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geoff501
Joined: 15 Mar 2007 Posts: 40 Location: Worcestershire
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Posted: Fri Aug 07, 2009 9:52 pm Post subject: |
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Hi,
Adam Brown wrote: | The 1914-21 GSE is still password protected. There have also been changes to the 1939-47 one. Be aware that the Regiment / Corps filed defaults to 'Australia' so this may throw up 0 results if you are searching for a UK fatality. |
WW1 is being worked on.
Sorry about the Aussie default. it was to help out with up to several thousand searches looking for Aussie non-comms. Since the form does not remember entry data between searches, I temporarily set them to Australia.
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It looks like you also need to have an initial too now on the 39-47 one which actually makes it more restricting in some ways than the CWGC site because there is not an option to search all nationalities.
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The initials were added some time ago and are not mandatory. All fields are optional. If you do search on initials and there is more than one, don't separate with spaces between them and it should work OK.
There are separate index files for each nationality, hence it is not convenient for me to do a search all nationalities run and I don't believe it has high priority for most searches.
If it ever gets more restricting than the CWGC site, I'll give in and take up golf
cheers,
geoff _________________ WW1, WW2:
www.hut-six.co.uk/cgi-bin/search14-21.php
www.hut-six.co.uk/cgi-bin/search39-47.php
SNWM search:
www.hut-six.co.uk/cgi-bin/searchswm.php |
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DerekR Moderator
Joined: 19 Dec 2006 Posts: 3013 Location: Hawick, Scotland
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Posted: Sat Aug 08, 2009 9:05 am Post subject: |
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geoff501 wrote: |
If it ever gets more restricting than the CWGC site, I'll give in and take up golf |
Nowt wrong with golf
You're doing a great job and you're engines are becoming indispensible so don't turn to golf just yet. _________________
Time but th' impression stronger makes, As streams their channels deeper wear. |
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Adam Brown Curator
Joined: 14 Dec 2006 Posts: 7312 Location: Edinburgh (From Sutherland)
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Posted: Mon Aug 10, 2009 8:18 am Post subject: |
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Geoff
Thanks for the updates and tips.
geoff501 wrote: | There are separate index files for each nationality, hence it is not convenient for me to do a search all nationalities run and I don't believe it has high priority for most searches.
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When you are searching a name from a war memorial and there is no indication of unit it's pretty handy to search all nationalities but I see now that is a problem for you, and as you say for most of the searches that won't be an issue. It's not a huge inconvenience to do a search on each nationality and the benefit of having the unit field in more than outweighs that.
DerekR wrote: | You're doing a great job and you're engines are becoming indispensible so don't turn to golf just yet. |
I'll second that, there's many a search I've done on your website that I just couldn't have done on the CWGC site.
Many thanks for your help.
Cheers
Adam |
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geoff501
Joined: 15 Mar 2007 Posts: 40 Location: Worcestershire
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Posted: Wed Aug 12, 2009 7:33 pm Post subject: |
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Adam Brown wrote: |
When you are searching a name from a war memorial and there is no indication of unit it's pretty handy to search all nationalities....
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To date I have found just 1 Australian, 3 Canadians, 1 South African and 0 New Zealand on my local memorial researches. But I guess this is not so in Scotland, where the numbers must be much higher.
There was an interesting program on Radio 4 this afternoon about this very subject:
"Laurie also discusses the worldwide influence of the Scottish diaspora and asks why such an enormous number Scots left their country of birth even when times were good. Tom Devine enlightens Laurie ahead of his talk at the Festival of Politics in Edinburgh."
It's available on Listen Again:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b00lynzd
(I think it said something like England owned the empire, but Scotland ran it!)
EDIT: It starts about 1:30 into the program
geoff _________________ WW1, WW2:
www.hut-six.co.uk/cgi-bin/search14-21.php
www.hut-six.co.uk/cgi-bin/search39-47.php
SNWM search:
www.hut-six.co.uk/cgi-bin/searchswm.php |
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spoons
Joined: 09 Jan 2007 Posts: 4991 Location: St John's Town of Dalry
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Posted: Wed Aug 12, 2009 9:42 pm Post subject: |
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I am just posting Kirkcudbright cemetery graves on the SWGP and 2 of the first 3 family gravestones were Canadians.
By the way, how do we get a login for the WW1 search engine page?
\Paul |
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Adam Brown Curator
Joined: 14 Dec 2006 Posts: 7312 Location: Edinburgh (From Sutherland)
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Posted: Thu Aug 13, 2009 11:38 am Post subject: |
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Geoff
Thanks for the Link, I'll listen to that later.
There are a great many CEF men listed on Scottish memorials and a fair few Australian, New Zealand and South African units too. On my local memorial out of sixty names there is one Australian, one South-African and eight who had served in the Canadian Expeditionary Force.
Interestingly for Kinlochbervie across the other side of Sutherland the numbers are one Canadian and five new Zealanders out of a total of 22.
For Rogart, in the middle of the County, out of 42 names there is one AIF, three CEF, two NZEF and two South Africans.
These are three communities in the North of Scotland so it may not be the case for other parts such as the Central Belt or the Borders but in these three cases they all have a high proportion of overseas units.
Cheers
Adam
Regards
Adam |
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geoff501
Joined: 15 Mar 2007 Posts: 40 Location: Worcestershire
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Posted: Thu Aug 13, 2009 6:04 pm Post subject: |
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Adam Brown wrote: | Geoff
Thanks for the Link, I'll listen to that later.
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You also get a short reading by John Laurie, WW1 vet both in and out of the 'Dad's Army' script. Now there's a program!
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These are three communities in the North of Scotland so it may not be the case for other parts such as the Central Belt or the Borders but in these three cases they all have a high proportion of overseas units.
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I'll typically find 1 or less on memorials of that size around here.
I thought the Western Isles had relatively large numbers head out to Canada. Would that be the case? _________________ WW1, WW2:
www.hut-six.co.uk/cgi-bin/search14-21.php
www.hut-six.co.uk/cgi-bin/search39-47.php
SNWM search:
www.hut-six.co.uk/cgi-bin/searchswm.php |
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kinnethmont
Joined: 19 Dec 2006 Posts: 1649 Location: Aberdeenshire
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Posted: Thu Aug 13, 2009 10:23 pm Post subject: Scots CEF men |
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Geoff
Large numbers of men / families linked to agriculture left rural areas of Scotland for Canada after c1904. Many had been Territorials and joined the Militia. The same was true to a lesser extent for Australia, New Zealand and South Africa in that order.
When the call went out to the Dominions in August 1914 large numbers of these men joined the CEF. Others enlisted out of Duty and some the prospect of a paid trip home.
This accounts for the very high numbers of CEF men on our memorials, in many cases brothers, cousins, etc. A figure well in excess of 13% of CEF casualties were born in Scotland. _________________ Jim
If ye break faith with us who die
We shall not sleep, though poppies grow
In Flanders fields.
www.kinnethmont.co.uk |
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spoons
Joined: 09 Jan 2007 Posts: 4991 Location: St John's Town of Dalry
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Posted: Fri Aug 14, 2009 9:20 am Post subject: |
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The Carsphairn memorial was unveiled by Lt Col Clark-Kennedy VC of Knockgray who served with the Canadians. Col John McCrae, author of 'in Flanders fields' served with the Canadians was the great grandson of a Carsphairn resident.
\Paul |
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DerekR Moderator
Joined: 19 Dec 2006 Posts: 3013 Location: Hawick, Scotland
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Posted: Fri Aug 14, 2009 2:10 pm Post subject: |
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spoons wrote: |
By the way, how do we get a login for the WW1 search engine page?
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I'm locked out as well _________________
Time but th' impression stronger makes, As streams their channels deeper wear. |
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Kenneth Morrison
Joined: 29 Sep 2008 Posts: 7761 Location: Rockcliffe Dalbeattie
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Posted: Fri Aug 14, 2009 7:10 pm Post subject: |
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Recently I've been in e-mail contact with the archivist of the Princess Patricia's Canadian Light Infantry (about ethnic Japanese who served in the Canadian Forces !!!) and his research indicates that until 1917 Canadian born recruits were in the minority. _________________ Ken |
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dhubthaigh Our first ever 1000-poster
Joined: 19 Dec 2006 Posts: 5071 Location: Blairgowrie, Perthshire
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Posted: Wed Aug 19, 2009 1:27 pm Post subject: |
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Can anyone tell me how to search or obtain a username/password ? I can't see an answer here
Mark |
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DelBoy
Joined: 12 Jul 2007 Posts: 4858 Location: The County of Angus
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Posted: Tue Sep 08, 2009 8:11 pm Post subject: |
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The ww1 search engine seems to be back online, there's pre-filled in login details so just click login and away you go. |
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spoons
Joined: 09 Jan 2007 Posts: 4991 Location: St John's Town of Dalry
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Posted: Thu Sep 24, 2009 8:16 pm Post subject: |
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Geoff now has a page explaining how these changes, when made, will prevent his search engine from working. I have today emailed CWGC as follows:
Dear Mr Stacey
I am very concerned about the proposed changes to the CWGC debt of honour register.
I accept that the remit of the CWGC is to record and honour the dead and it does not have a remit to aid family history or military history researchers but I do not think it should be making changes which seem designed to prevent others from providing such a service.
I am a regional volunteer for the War Memorials Trust and a member of both the Scottish War Memorials Project and the Scottish War Graves Project and give public talks on researching war memorials and those who died in war, all on a purely voluntary basis. I also work in a school where I help pupils research war dead as part of their curriculum studies on war and remembrance.
I believe that the changes will stop any links direct to individual entries on the database from working. This means that any links that I have sent in the past to relatives of the deceased will no longer work (I frequently identify individuals for surviving relatives and send them the info by way of a link, free of charge). I don't think that your proposed changes are fair to any of these individuals - I know some who like to record the link as part of their family tree.
I also make use of 'Geoff's search engines' which has far greater search facilities than your site and which then points to the records found. I encourage pupils at the school where I work (and others) to use these engines as part of the research into and commemoration of war dead. Local war memorials often contain only names or perhaps names and regiments. Without a rank or date of death, this is often the only way to identify the individual commemorated. I feel that this research by today's children is essential to their understanding. I mean this as no criticism of the CWGC site as I understand the limited remit and funds but I understand that the changes you propose will prevent such search engines from working and surely you can see that preventing others from carrying out such research does nothing to assist the continued commemoration of those who gave their lives?
In short, I believe that 'not forgotten' means that each generation should be able to find out exactly who these men and women were from the scant information available on their local memorial and I strongly urge you not to make any changes which would reduce their ability to do this.
Yours sincerely |
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kinnethmont
Joined: 19 Dec 2006 Posts: 1649 Location: Aberdeenshire
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Posted: Thu Sep 24, 2009 8:32 pm Post subject: |
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Paul
Below is the text of a recent reply to a member of another Forum from David Stacey's boss Peter Francis (Head of External Communications, CWGC) .
I think they now fully understand the position regarding links to their records ( see final sentence). Allowing 3rd party software to search their data is another matter. You may be aware that the data Geoff's Search used was an outdated record and CWGC still needs to be checked to verify the latest information on casualties.
Personally, I suspect when a new CWGC search appears it will be more helpful to researchers than is currently the case.
Quote: | As I am sure you can appreciate, the Commission is motivated to improve, upgrade and develop its Website and the Casualty Database behind the website to provide a better facility for our users and staff. The alteration to our Search Tool was a first step in this process which is ongoing and it should be appreciated that we have consulted with users both individually and through user groups and acted on the advice of consultants in implementing the changes.
However, as we are now aware of the concerns mentioned by users like yourself, as well as the technical issues mentioned above, we will take further advice from our IT experts to try and seek a solution that meets CWGC aims and the aims of all users. This can now be done with an understanding of the dependency of other parties upon the links they have made to our casualty data and some knowledge about how those links work. |
_________________ Jim
If ye break faith with us who die
We shall not sleep, though poppies grow
In Flanders fields.
www.kinnethmont.co.uk |
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