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GEORGE A. C. MACKINLAY - A PUZZLE **Now commemorated**
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dhubthaigh
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PostPosted: Sun May 10, 2009 1:37 pm    Post subject: GEORGE A. C. MACKINLAY - A PUZZLE **Now commemorated** Reply with quote

The following text is taken from Perth Academy and Sharp's Institution Magazine.

1. - The staff has lost two of its youngest members. 2nd Lieut. Robet W. Ferguson, of the Mathematical Department, previously reported wounded and missing, is now reported killed. Corporal [sic] George A. C. MacKinlay, of the English Department, was killed in action in the month of August [sic].

2. - School Staff on Active Service.
G. A. C. MacKinlay, Corporal, Scottish Rifles.

From SNWM;

Surname MACKINLAY
Firstname G A C
Service Number 200909
Date Death 15/10/1917
Decoration
Place of birth Glasgow
Other 5th Bn.
SNWM roll THE CAMERONIANS (SCOTTISH RIFLES)
Rank Pte
Theatre of death France.

MIC;



He appears on the Perth Academy War Memorial;

http://warmemscot.s4.bizhat.com/viewtopic.php?t=1664

HOWEVER, I cannot seem to find him on the CWGC, Soldiers Died. I had one credit left for Scotland's People but no match for said name, 1917.


Last edited by dhubthaigh on Thu Jul 07, 2016 7:01 pm; edited 1 time in total
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kinnethmont



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PostPosted: Sun May 10, 2009 3:26 pm    Post subject: GEORGE A. C. MACKINLAY Reply with quote

Mark

There seems the possibility he might well be a non commemorated casualty.
It may be he is already known about and in the system for checking. I will check further and advise.

The SNWM date does not tie with the detail below which supports the Perth record.

More info

George Alexander Cheyne Mackinlay, born on 20th October 1890, was the eldest son of Mr. George Mackinlay, 65 Bank Street, Hillhead. He was killed in France on the 15th August 1917. Educated at Hillhead High School, he proceeded to Glasgow University, where he graduated MA, with honours in English Literature, Language, and History in 1912.

In 1913, he was appointed assistant English master in Perth Academy, which post he held until he joined the Army in 1914. It is no secret now to say that the headmaster was hoping to see him on the first available opportunity established as one of the English masters in his old School. He was at all times a keen sportsman, and entered fully into the athletic and social life of the School, both as a pupil and as a member of the Former Pupils’ Club. An enthusiastic player of Rugby, a leading member of the Literary Association, whose Magazine he founded and edited, he was perhaps one of the best and most widely known of the former pupils of the School.

To those who knew him there is no need to praise him, but some things may be recalled in tribute to his memory. Clean-minded, generous-hearted as boy and man, he was never known to do a mean act or to take an ignoble view of life. A poet and dreamer at heart, he took the best out of life. As a memorial to this gallant soldier and scholar a small volume of his poems has been published. This for his friends – but for himself - "He hath outsoared the shadow of our night."
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In Flanders fields.

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dhubthaigh
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PostPosted: Sun May 10, 2009 3:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jim,

Awesome info, where did you get that Shocked

Mark
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dhubthaigh
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PostPosted: Sun May 10, 2009 3:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

No photo on the Glasgow University web site unfortunately.
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Stewartry



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PostPosted: Sun May 10, 2009 3:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I deleted my first post because I somehow managed to miss that the SNWM details were given.

I have searched the online casualty lists and he is listed in The Scotsman - Monday, 24th September 1917, page 7:

Cameronians (Scottish Rifles.)—Armstrong, 36681, A (Alexandria); Black. 200743, ,D. (Glasgow); Boaninani 28053 . J. (Glasgorwl; Brovm ^ .265379. L--CpL H. (Glas gow): Ca-rroa,24991, F. (Glasgow); Chalmers,33002.W. M. (Coatbridge): Dongjas, 31627. G. E. (SeDdrk); Elktt, ' 19946, L-CpL T. (Tanbridge WelU); Forrestsr. 23072 A. (Lochee); Gardner, 40037. G. (Dandee): Grant, 200472 & (Glaspnr);garrison, 10206. Sgt. D. (Sheffield): Hastie 33024D. 3. "W. (Glasgow); Hood201275. J. (Glasgow) Jackson, 33026. L--CpL E. (Doraock). M'Cnlloch. 32966 H. (Ajrl; MTsfen25651, G. (Glasgow): MianUy, 200909, G. (Glasgow); Martin, 40778, W. 'Gorebridge); .Monagban 14583, T. (Glasgow); O'Concer, 241801. J. (New Lsoaik); Eankin, 40745, C. (Glasgow); BeTcfelds. 30051, F." A (GlasgGTT): Eowan. 40063. L.-Cpl. J. (Glasgow): Shaw 25940, F. (OMtown); Simpson. 757S. J. (Glasgow); Teaaaat, 33103, J. F. (Glasgow); Walls, 13074, L.-CpL J (Glasgow)

The above is the automatic transcription of the men listed in the Cameronians' killed list. There should be enough usable info to check for the other dates of death. The date of listing (24th September 1917) fits with a mid-August death.

Stuart
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Last edited by Stewartry on Sun May 10, 2009 4:05 pm; edited 2 times in total
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Stewartry



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PostPosted: Sun May 10, 2009 3:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Of the obvious 1/5th Battalion men listed, 200748 & 200472 were both killed on 16th Aug 1917, while 201273 was killed on 17th Aug 1917.

Stuart
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dhubthaigh
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PostPosted: Sun May 10, 2009 4:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Stuart,

Thanks for that also. Appears to be a strange one! An extremely intelligent and gifted young man who has apparently been a non-commemoration for all these years ?
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dhubthaigh
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PostPosted: Sun May 10, 2009 4:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Surname BLACK
Firstname D
Service Number 200748
Date Death 16/08/1917
Decoration
Place of birth
Other 5th Bn.
SNWM roll THE CAMERONIANS (SCOTTISH RIFLES)
Rank Pte
Theatre of death France.

Name: BLACK, DAVID
Initials: D
Nationality: United Kingdom
Rank: Private
Regiment/Service: Cameronians (Scottish Rifles)
Unit Text: 2nd Bn.
Age: 28
Date of Death: 16/08/1917
Service No: 200748
Additional information: Son of David and Jane R. Black, of Glasgow.
Casualty Type: Commonwealth War Dead
Grave/Memorial Reference: Enclosure No.4 XII. K. 15.
Cemetery: BEDFORD HOUSE CEMETERY


Surname GRANT
Firstname D
Service Number 200472
Date Death 16/08/1917
Decoration
Place of birth Glasgow
Other 5th Bn.
SNWM roll THE CAMERONIANS (SCOTTISH RIFLES)
Rank Pte
Theatre of death France.

Surname HOOD
Firstname J H
Service Number 201273
Date Death 17/08/1917
Decoration
Place of birth Glasgow
Other 5th Bn.
SNWM roll THE CAMERONIANS (SCOTTISH RIFLES)
Rank Pte
Theatre of death France.

From the numbers provided by Stuart - Black commemorated by CWGC but Grant & Hood not - unless I'm missing something.
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Adam Brown
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PostPosted: Sun May 10, 2009 7:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mark

No, I've tried both names in the CWGC database and haven't found them either.

Regards

Adam
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kinnethmont



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PostPosted: Sun May 10, 2009 7:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Adam

I checked earlier and it does appear both are missing from CWGC.

The strange thing is that they are also missing from SDGW which make one wonder where the SNWM info came from. A truly " missing " man is not usually recorded anywhere. Casualty returns cannot be relied on as proof and a later return might have advised they were POW's, etc.
It might be they are on SNWM in error. I am waiting to see if they are already listed as possible CWGC non comms.
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If ye break faith with us who die
We shall not sleep, though poppies grow
In Flanders fields.

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Last edited by kinnethmont on Wed Jun 10, 2009 6:27 pm; edited 1 time in total
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spoons



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PostPosted: Sun May 10, 2009 8:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Did anyone else notice that their dates of death are on consecutive days?

\Paul
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Adam Brown
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PostPosted: Sun May 10, 2009 8:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jim

Thanks for checking SDGW, that was the next stop for me to see if there was any other information. It's strange they are not there too. I always though the SNWM came from the same source as the SDGW.

This is a strange situation I hope more information can be found to clarify it one way or the other.

What about the War Returns in General Register Office? I know the infomation there is basic but if they are not listed there than that should mean that they didn't die shouldn't it?

Regards

Adam
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spoons



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PostPosted: Sun May 10, 2009 8:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Medal card for Grant clearly shows killed in action



The number is right but name does not tie up with first initial.

\Paul
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PostPosted: Sun May 10, 2009 8:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

No MIC for Hood on Ancestry and no service record for either.

\Paul
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Adam Brown
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PostPosted: Sun May 10, 2009 8:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Is the name on the Medal Card Index Charles Grant? CWGC doesn't list a Charles Grant died on that date serving in Scottish Rifles.

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