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St Marys School Glasgow

 
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spoons



Joined: 09 Jan 2007
Posts: 4991
Location: St John's Town of Dalry

PostPosted: Tue Jan 30, 2007 5:14 pm    Post subject: St Marys School Glasgow Reply with quote

Please see St Josephs College Chapel, Dumfries for explanation of how these memorials come to be in Dumfries.

OS Map Ref: NX 979 756

UKNIWM Ref: 44260 is the Great War Memorial - this is a stained glass window only and there is no list of names associated with this window as far as is known.

UKNIWM Ref: 44263 is the brass plaque for WW2





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Adam Brown
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Joined: 14 Dec 2006
Posts: 7312
Location: Edinburgh (From Sutherland)

PostPosted: Tue Jan 30, 2007 9:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Interesting plaque.

Only some names have a date against them. Are the bottom two names unconnected to war?

Italo Prada doesn't sound very Scottish and John Gobel was a civilian,who died in the London Blitz. There are two John Gobels listed though:

Name: GOBEL, JOHN ALOYSIUS
Initials: J A
Nationality: United Kingdom
Rank: Civilian
Regiment/Service: Civilian War Dead
Age: 20
Date of Death: 08/12/1940
Additional information: Air Raid Warden; of 95 Tower Bridge Road. Son of F. Gobel, and of John Leonard Gobel. Died at Abbey Street.
Casualty Type: Civilian War Dead
Reporting Authority: BERMONDSEY, METROPOLITAN BOROUGH

Name: GOBEL, JOHN LEONARD
Initials: J L
Nationality: United Kingdom
Rank: Civilian
Regiment/Service: Civilian War Dead
Age: 52
Date of Death: 08/12/1940
Additional information: of 95 Tower Bridge Road. Husband of F. Gobel. Died at Abbey Street.
Casualty Type: Civilian War Dead
Reporting Authority: BERMONDSEY, METROPOLITAN BOROUGH

Father and son killed at the same time. There are no F Gobels listed for 1940 so it looks like the wife / mother survived. I wonder which one is commemorated?

I struggled to find other names in the CWGC database

There is only one Patrick Dennehy in CWGC and the date matched 1943

Name: DENNEHY, PATRICK DANIEL
Initials: P D
Nationality: United Kingdom
Rank: Sergeant (Pilot)
Regiment/Service: Royal Air Force Volunteer Reserve
Age: 21
Date of Death: 01/03/1943
Service No: 1336450
Additional information: Son of Daniel and Beatrice Dennehy, of Ramsgate.
Casualty Type: Commonwealth War Dead
Grave/Memorial Reference: Ramsgate Div. Sec. M.A. Grave 145.
Cemetery: RAMSGATE AND ST. LAWRENCE CEMETERY

There is also only one Norman Bateman

Name: BATEMAN, NORMAN DENNIS
Initials: N D
Nationality: United Kingdom
Rank: Lieutenant
Regiment/Service: Royal Naval Reserve
Unit Text: H.M.S. Lundy
Age: 24
Date of Death: 05/11/1946
Additional information: Son of Mark Frederick George and Harmah Ada Bateman, of Ramsgate, Kent.
Casualty Type: Commonwealth War Dead
Grave/Memorial Reference: Panel 90, Column 3.
Memorial: PORTSMOUTH NAVAL MEMORIAL

Both from Ramsgate, a long way from Glasgow. Are you sure this is a St Mary's plaque Spoons?


Adam

Adam
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spoons



Joined: 09 Jan 2007
Posts: 4991
Location: St John's Town of Dalry

PostPosted: Tue Jan 30, 2007 10:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well that is what the janitor told me, that it was a St Marys memorial (although he was not particularly sure) but the UKNIWM is quite precise on it, all the other plaques in the chapel tie up very well so there is no room to confuse it with another. There is one discrepancy and that is UKNIWM counts 11 and 2 but there are 12 names in total. I guess that someone might be able to trace the logo and motto on the plaque. SMOBA = Saint Marys Old Boys Association?
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dhubthaigh
Our first ever 1000-poster


Joined: 19 Dec 2006
Posts: 5070
Location: Blairgowrie, Perthshire

PostPosted: Tue Jan 30, 2007 11:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Name: PRADA, ITALO
Initials: I
Nationality: United Kingdom
Rank: Sergeant (Air Gnr.)
Regiment/Service: Royal Air Force Volunteer Reserve
Unit Text: 9 Sqdn.
Date of Death: 31/03/1944
Service No: 1390154
Casualty Type: Commonwealth War Dead
Grave/Memorial Reference: 5. F. 1.
Cemetery: HANOVER WAR CEMETERY

I googled Italo Prada and this appeared;

Flight Sergeant (Air Bomber) Thomas Santola Fletcher, who with five other members of his crew was reported killed in action when Lancaster III serial W5006 Code WS-X from 9 Sqn took off from RAF Bardney at 2205 on the evening of 30/03/1944 on Ops to Nuremberg. It was shot down on the outward journey by an Me110 (Maj Martin Drewes III.NJG1) and crashed at Cleeberg 8km WNW of Butzbach.

The other members of the crew who were also reported killed in action were:

Flying Officer (Pilot) James Gordon Richmond Ling
Sergeant (Flt Engr) Leonard Moss
Sergeant (WOp/Air Gnr) Edgar Alexander Gauld
Pilot Officer (Air Gnr) Edward James Rush RCAF
Sergeant (Air Gnr) Italo Prada (Rear Gunner) - buried with the other five kia in Hanover War Cemetery. His Italian father had been interned in the Isle of Man at time of his son's death in action.
Sergeant H Laws (Nav) was taken POW and taken to Stalag 357 Kopernikus.

Contact (via Mike Prada): Prada AT Prada.co.uk

Possibility
Name: GILLESPIE, HUGH GORDON
Initials: H G
Nationality: Canadian
Rank: Sergeant (W.Op./Air Gnr.)
Regiment/Service: Royal Canadian Air Force
Unit Text: 405 Sqdn.
Age: 31
Date of Death: 14/11/1942
Service No: R/95484
Additional information: Son of George Murray Gillespie and Ida Jane Gillespie, of Port Coquitlam, British Columbia, Canada.
Casualty Type: Commonwealth War Dead
Grave/Memorial Reference: Grave 1319.
Cemetery: ST. COLUMB MAJOR CEMETERY

Name: WALSH, LEONARD
Initials: L
Nationality: United Kingdom
Rank: Private
Regiment/Service: The Loyal Regiment (North Lancashire)
Unit Text: 2nd Bn.
Date of Death: 30/05/1943
Service No: 3855502
Additional information: Son of David and Elizabeth Ann Walsh, of Bolton, Lancashire.
Casualty Type: Commonwealth War Dead
Grave/Memorial Reference: Sp. Mem. 9. M. 4.
Cemetery: KANCHANABURI WAR CEMETERY
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jardinep



Joined: 01 Mar 2007
Posts: 3

PostPosted: Fri Mar 02, 2007 2:35 pm    Post subject: st. joseph's college chapel Reply with quote

Having read your captions I would like to add that the brass plaque is not from St. Mary's school in Glasgow, but is in fact from a school that the Marist Brothers ran on the south coast of england callled St. Mary's College, Grove Ferry. This plaque was found around 10 years ago and I put it up in the chapel.
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spoons



Joined: 09 Jan 2007
Posts: 4991
Location: St John's Town of Dalry

PostPosted: Fri Mar 02, 2007 3:44 pm    Post subject: Re: st. joseph's college chapel Reply with quote

jardinep wrote:
Having read your captions I would like to add that the brass plaque is not from St. Mary's school in Glasgow, but is in fact from a school that the Marist Brothers ran on the south coast of england callled St. Mary's College, Grove Ferry. This plaque was found around 10 years ago and I put it up in the chapel.

Well that is a surprise, not just to me but to whoever registered this memorial with UKNIWM. The Imperial War Museum has this down as St Mary's Glasgow. At first look, finding two memorials to identically named schools at opposite ends of the country in a third location would seem to be unlikely. But if you know that the location is the home of a religious order and that religious order (catholic) named the schools after Mary, then it is understandable. I would like to know however if St Mary's School Glasgow had a WW2 memorial or if St Mary's College, Grove Ferry had a WW1 memorial if anyone happens to know.
Very grateful that you had a hand in putting this back on display and helping to properly document it.
I found the following link to Brother Walfrid and his role in founding both St Mary's College and Celtic FC http://www.bhoyfever.co.uk/custom.php?page=walfrid&clubid=2
Grove Ferry is just outside Canterbury by the way.
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Adam Brown
Curator


Joined: 14 Dec 2006
Posts: 7312
Location: Edinburgh (From Sutherland)

PostPosted: Fri Mar 02, 2007 4:31 pm    Post subject: Re: st. joseph's college chapel Reply with quote

spoons wrote:
Grove Ferry is just outside Canterbury by the way.


...and only a few miles from Ramsgate which ties in with the names above.

I'll second spoons in thanking Jardinep for updating the forum on these memorials and making sure they were put in the chapel where those named could be remembered and the memorials looked after.

Regards

Adam
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