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War Memorial Darvel - Cleland Family Machine Gun Corps

 
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JAMIESONFAMILY



Joined: 14 Feb 2018
Posts: 4
Location: Kent

PostPosted: Mon Mar 12, 2018 10:13 am    Post subject: War Memorial Darvel - Cleland Family Machine Gun Corps Reply with quote

My Great Uncles Nicol and William Jamieson are commemorated on the War Memorial in Darvel. My family tree includes the family name Cleland.
Can anyone give me any information about the two PTE William Clelands Machine Gun Corps.
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Kenneth Morrison



Joined: 29 Sep 2008
Posts: 5211
Location: Rockcliffe Dalbeattie

PostPosted: Mon Mar 12, 2018 7:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

This may be one of them:
CWGC
Private
CLELLAND, W
Service Number 132479
Died 11/04/1918
34th Coy.
Machine Gun Corps (Infantry)
CROIX-DU-BAC BRITISH CEMETERY, STEENWERCK, Nord, France
SNWM CLELAND (one L) born Loudon, Ayr.
Soldiers effects Mother Agnes (one L )

There is also a Service Record for 187615 William Cleland, Arran View, Darvel. Royal Garrison Artillery. Survived the war discharged 1920. Father William.
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JAMIESONFAMILY



Joined: 14 Feb 2018
Posts: 4
Location: Kent

PostPosted: Sat Mar 31, 2018 10:45 am    Post subject: War Memorial Darvel - Cleland Family Machine Gun Corps Reply with quote

Thank you for you reply.
I have now identified both William Clelands
1 William Cleland 34th Bn MGC born Darvel died 11.4.1918
2. William Cleland Driver 54th MGC born 1897 died 22.2.1919
Neither appear to be related but I shall remember their sacrifice
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JAMIESONFAMILY



Joined: 14 Feb 2018
Posts: 4
Location: Kent

PostPosted: Wed Apr 11, 2018 8:30 am    Post subject: War Memorial Darvel - Cleland Family Machine Gun Corps Reply with quote

Ken
I have an update on this entry for information only
The two William Cleland's were cousins. I have found no CWGC reference to the William that died 22.2.19. I have checked with the MGC archives and there is no record of his discharge before his death. I will contact the CWGC regarding a request to have him commemorated

Regards
Sue
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Kenneth Morrison



Joined: 29 Sep 2008
Posts: 5211
Location: Rockcliffe Dalbeattie

PostPosted: Wed Apr 11, 2018 11:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi Sue
The Army Registers of Soldiers Effects (access via Ancestry.co.uk) lists "your" William as Private 4117 MGC died at Darvel, Ayrshire.
Father: Alexander.
and his Medal Roll shows that he served originally as Private S/13056 in the Gordon Highlanders. There is no date on his Medal Card, indicating that he went overseas after 1915.

I don't see a service record for him, so there is no evidence to say what the reason for his discharge from the army was. It may not have been related to his service. In which case CWGC will not recognise him as a war death.

Is there anything on his death certificate which would indicate that his death was due to his military service?
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Kenneth Morrison



Joined: 29 Sep 2008
Posts: 5211
Location: Rockcliffe Dalbeattie

PostPosted: Wed Apr 11, 2018 11:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sue - my interest got the better of me!

I've just had a look at the death register page and the first entry (your William) and the second entry are almost identical in layout, detail and cause of death (influenza & pneumonia) The interesting thing is that the second man is recorded on the CWGC Register.
Second Lieutenant
CRAWFORD, J S
Died 05/03/1919
Aged 30
Royal Scots Fusiliers
Son of Robert Crawford; Husband of Jessie Richardson Crawford, of 8, Kirkland Rd., Darvel.

So it could be argued (I think) that both men were still serving when they died and that both should be on the CWGC Register.
It could be well worth while asking the folks at the "In From the Cold Project" for some advice as they would know if there was a case.
http://infromthecold.org/report_missing_casualty.asp

I hope you don't mind me looking into this but it is really interesting.
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