The Scottish Military Research Group - Commemorations Project

Kenneth Morrison · Posted: Sun Jun 12, 2011 3:22 pm Post subject: Germanic sounding names on WM's

Anne raised a question about a family grave on SWGP
http://scottishwargraves.phpbbweb.com/viewtopic.php?p=21387#21387
about James Albert Homberg who served as 2nd Lt James Albert Smith
(his mother's maiden name)
I assume that his family surname was considered too "germanic"????
I was wondering how War Memorial Committees would have handled such a case????

Name: SMITH, JAMES ALBERT
Initials: J A
Nationality: United Kingdom
Rank: Second Lieutenant
Regiment/Service: Royal Field Artillery
Unit Text: 30th Div. Ammunition Col.
Date of Death: 21/03/1918
Casualty Type: Commonwealth War Dead
Grave/Memorial Reference: Panel 7 to 10.
Memorial: POZIERES MEMORIAL
_________________
Ken

kinnethmont · Joined: 19 Dec 2006 Posts: 1649 Location: Aberdeenshire

Ken

I suspect Memorial Commitees might well have used the family name Homberg, as it would have been well known locally. Unless he actually changed his name legally after 1911 they would not have known of him as Smith if he simply used this name ( which happens to be his mother's maiden name) on enlisting
There are cases where the family did not want a man recorded on a memorial with links to Germany, such as this, being one of the reasons this sometimes occurred. It was ther choice to make.
_________________
Jim

If ye break faith with us who die
We shall not sleep, though poppies grow
In Flanders fields.

www.kinnethmont.co.uk

Kenneth Morrison · Posted: Sun Jun 12, 2011 4:40 pm Post subject:

Thanks Jim
I guess I was wondering whether the "anti-german" sentiments which were around in the early years of the war would still have been in evidence.
Another random thought - were there anti-bulgarian or anti-turkish riots?
_________________
Ken

apanderson · Posted: Sun Jun 12, 2011 7:03 pm Post subject:

I has a wee look at both Bearsden & Milngavie Civic Memorials - no Hombergs or Smiths.

No sign of him on the Evening Times Roll of Honour either.

Looking at Census Returns, unless his father Gustav has been mis-transcribed, it looks as though he only came here sometime between 1881 - 1891.

The family were living at Gala Cottage in Rothesay Bute 1891 and Gustav Snr's birthplace is '(Colonised) Gamay', occupation 'Tummys Manufacturers Agent'.

Colonised Germany? Confused

By 1891 they're at 46 Cahkin Road, Cathcart - no sign of father Gustav, it was just Margaret and the weans. She is listed as Button Manufacurer's Agents Wife and young Albert's birthplace listed as Glasgow. (Just Albert - not James Albert)

(I like Tummy Manufacturer's Agent best!!) Laughing

kinnethmont · Joined: 19 Dec 2006 Posts: 1649 Location: Aberdeenshire

DelBoy · Posted: Thu Aug 11, 2011 10:34 pm Post subject: Otto

There's a Cpl. Frederick Otto Black on Scoonie Parish, Leven.

Name: BLACK, FREDERICK OTTO
Initials: F O
Nationality: United Kingdom
Rank: Private
Regiment/Service: Black Watch (Royal Highlanders)
Unit Text: "A" Coy. 2nd Bn.
Age: 25
Date of Death: 09/05/1915
Service No: 3/1231
Additional information: Son of Joseph and L. A. Black, of 45, East High St., Methil, Fife.
Casualty Type: Commonwealth War Dead
Grave/Memorial Reference: Panels 24 to 26.
Memorial: LE TOURET MEMORIAL

It's only a middle name, but Otto is German, right?.....

Cheers,
Derek.

Adam Brown · Posted: Fri Aug 12, 2011 8:25 am Post subject:

We had a Hans as a middle name the other day too. Otto is very Germanic but I'm sure there was a Norman with a name like that (Norman as in Normandy, not someone called Norman).
The man who commissioned the Bayeux tapestry was Duke Odo, Bishop of Bayeux but he is sometimes called Otto.

I also think that it is used by Norwegians.

Adam

DelBoy · Posted: Sun Aug 28, 2011 4:03 pm Post subject: F.J.W. Focken

Listed upon Dollar Academy memorial is Fred Focken

Name: FOCKEN, FREDERICK JOHN WILLIAM
Initials: F J W
Nationality: United Kingdom
Rank: Captain
Regiment/Service: Royal Army Service Corps
Age: 37
Date of Death: between 18/12/1941 and 25/12/1941
Service No: 221883
Additional information: Son of Frederick John Charles and Mary Focken; husband of Frances Beatrice Focken, of Bowral, New South Wales, Australia.
Casualty Type: Commonwealth War Dead
Grave/Memorial Reference: Column 21.
Memorial: SAI WAN MEMORIAL

DelBoy · Posted: Wed Sep 07, 2011 5:16 am Post subject: Planck

Andrew W. Planck is on the Rothesay memorials names for WW2.
Although he was recorded as Plank by CWGC.

(See further explanation on Rothesay thread)

Cheers,
Derek.

DelBoy · Posted: Sat Nov 05, 2011 3:02 am Post subject:

Carl Otto Anderson is the 7th casualty listed upon the Bo'ness memorial.
His forenames are very Germanic sounding.

Derek.

DelBoy · Posted: Thu Nov 17, 2011 8:11 am Post subject:

Hugh L. Schulze is on the Gala memorial.

Derek.

DerekR · Posted: Thu Nov 17, 2011 9:29 am Post subject:

DelBoy · Posted: Tue Mar 20, 2012 2:48 pm Post subject: David Kienzler - H.L.I.

I'm unsure of its origin but the thoroughly unscottish sounding Kienzler is upon the memorial at Newmilns in Ayrshire.

Davids parents were David and Jane, so the name had perhaps been in the area for some time?

Derek.

DelBoy · Posted: Tue Feb 11, 2014 11:58 pm Post subject:

Scots lad Albert Zeller, who is on Stirlings memorial, had german parents, there was no hiding this in his death notice in the JUNE scotsman notice of his death in action.

(The Scotsman 12th June 1915)
"Private Albert Zeller, 1st Cameron Highlanders (reported killed), who was born in Stirling, was a son of Mr George Zeller, a German, who carried on a Pork butcher's business in Stirling. He was a joiner to trade, and enlisted last September. For a number of years he was a member of the 7th Battalion Argyll & Sutherland Highlanders (T.F.)."

Born in Stirling in 1891 to George Zeller, a butcher, and Margaretha Schrof, who were marriend in Middlesborough in 1873. He was killed in action aged 23.

CWGC
ZELLER, ALBERT
Rank: Private
Service No: 3/6096
Date of Death: 09/05/1915
Regiment/Service: Cameron Highlanders 1st Bn.
Panel Reference: Panel 41 and 42.
Memorial: LE TOURET MEMORIAL

Roxy · Posted: Thu Mar 27, 2014 2:01 pm Post subject:

A number of my rellies named 'Becker' fought during the Great War. Although they lived in Edinburgh, their dad was German.

Roxy
_________________
Remembering my ggf, Pte Thomas Roberts, 10 SR, killed 25 Sep 15 at Loos.
Also remembering Flt Lt Al Squires and CXX/3 killed 2 Sep 06 in Afghanistan.