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In From the Cold Project (IFCP)

 
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kinnethmont



Joined: 19 Dec 2006
Posts: 1649
Location: Aberdeenshire

PostPosted: Thu May 21, 2009 10:57 pm    Post subject: In From the Cold Project (IFCP) Reply with quote

The subject of the In From the Cold Project (IFCP) and the work we are doing to locate those not commemorated by CWGC was discussed in another thread before the Non Comms section was created.

21st May 2009
IN FROM THE COLD WEBSITE LAUNCHED


The IFCP website has been some months in the making and went " live " this afternoon. You will find many areas of interest including comprehensive details of the workings of CWGC and the Non Comms being found. It is possible to submit brief details of a suspected non comm via a contact form.

For those who still wish to add the initial details of suspected cases in this section I remain quite happy to assist and liase here and can help if a suspected non comm warrants further action



http://infromthecold.org


I think it would be helpful to clarify the workings of the " In From the Cold Project "

IFCP are not involved in post discharge cases and only deal with those involving " in-service " casualties who are missing from the CWGC Debt of Honour Register. IFCP have an arrangement in place whereby they can fund the purchase of the death certificate for those cases which qualify for consideration by the military authorities.

Anyone who wishes to may become a volunteer. I would suggest this is the better option to duplicating the work currently done, or being done, even if it is " a much smaller project " I am aware that a considerable number in the IFCP pipeline currently are from Scottish units.

IFCP is highly organised and volunteers have to undertake the tasks allotted to them and cannot pick and choose an area they wish to research (ie Scotland). The process involves a very systematic search of archive material and cannot be fragmented.

The tasks of an IFCP volunteer are:-
1) To receive specific batches of pages taken from the GRO Overseas Death Indices – usually amounting to about 1000 names at a time. The volunteer is required to use Microsoft Word (or compatible system) for this.

2) To compare every single name against the CWGC Debt of Honour database and to record any not found on the IFCP Report Form provided. Access to a special piece of software will be provided to volunteers to make this task easier.
This can be a tedious task requiring good eyesight and a reasonable knowledge (not expert) of UK regimental names/abbreviations etc and lots of patience. Some of the pages have poor reproduction. Two trial pages are usually sent to new volunteers as a test.

Ideally, the volunteer would have access to the S&N disk containing these indices or a subscription to Find My Past where they can be found online. If neither of these is the case, then paper copies can be supplied to the volunteer.

3) To note any variation in Date of Death or name found in any entry during these searches.

4) To complete the Form as required
5) To do the same for the next batch!


IFCP will continue single-mindedly until its task is completed in about 2012

If anyone wants more info or contact details, please send me a PM.
http://infromthecold.org

********************************


UPDATE 1st September 2010

Some of you will be aware that IFC have had access to funding involving MOD where we can obtain a refund for Death Certificates, where UK personel are involved who died in service. As you might imagine the " rules " we have to operate under are rigid and exclude any " post discharge " cases.


There is no list of service personnel who died after service of related wounds or illness so cases tend to be found individually by someone researching their family, a regiment or a war memorial etc. With advice, many such ‘finders’ happily obtain the death certificate (almost always an essential piece of evidence) and put the case forward to CWGC/MoD – often through IFCP. However, in many instances, the finder is unwilling or, more often, unable to pay for this document (currently £9.25 for an England and Wales certificate). We hope we have found a way to help with this financial barrier in many cases – though not in all.

From today, we are going to operate a reimbursement scheme for such cases. To comply with our restrictions from MoD and to stick to the aims stated in our original proposal, we have had to come up with a slightly bureaucratic set of rules but we must avoid wasting our finite funds and cannot be seen to be paying for someone’s family research! The basic system will be as follows.

IFCP will reimburse the cost of an England & Wales or Northern Irish death certificate at the current rate if an application is received which complies with all our rules (which will be supplied to an applicant). A flat sum of £4 will be paid for Scottish death certificate entries obtained from Scotland’s People (which are as good as but cheaper than a full certificate). The basic rules are:

1) The scheme is not retrospective and only applies to certificates dated 1st September 2010 onwards.
2) The certificate must be purchased by the applicant in the first place.
3) The applicant must submit all evidence to IFCP to see if there is a case to answer and if there is a reasonable chance of success. If we agree that there is, the original certificate must be sent to IFCP for retention and IFCP will process the case.
4) IFCP will refund the cost of the certificate upon receipt. A refund will not depend on the case being accepted by MoD – simply on us believing that it is a valid case. Therefore IFCP will bear the risk of it being rejected.
5) The case will become an official IFCP case with the applicant recorded as the finder.
6) The scheme will only apply to UK service personnel cases (including British personnel in the Indian forces and those from colonial forces).

The scheme will NOT apply to cases where the certificate is dated before 1st September, where the applicant wants to retain the original certificate or where they wish to process the case themselves (which is obviously their prerogative). IFCP will happily continue to process such cases for the finder as before if they wish. At the moment, any refund will only be in pounds sterling as we cannot pay sums in foreign currencies so this will limit it to people with UK bank accounts or sterling accounts overseas. A full list of the rules is available upon request.


I will be closely involved with cases involving deaths in Scotland and can assist in the usual way via the Non Comm section here as to whether a valid case can be made. I can also advise regarding queries generally and the documents required for a case.
In many cases those interested are content to meet the cost of the documents, but it does add up, and hopefully this will be of help to some.

If anyone wants more info or contact details, please send me a PM.
http://infromthecold.org
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Jim

If ye break faith with us who die
We shall not sleep, though poppies grow
In Flanders fields.

www.kinnethmont.co.uk
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kinnethmont



Joined: 19 Dec 2006
Posts: 1649
Location: Aberdeenshire

PostPosted: Sat Feb 05, 2011 5:28 pm    Post subject: In From the Cold Project (IFCP) Reply with quote

Those contributing to this section may be interested to know that with addition of nine Australians to the CWGC Roll today the total number of IFCP cases accepted now stands at 1002. Not one has been declined.

We currently have another 799 with the relevant military authority in many different countries.
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If ye break faith with us who die
We shall not sleep, though poppies grow
In Flanders fields.

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DerekR
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Joined: 19 Dec 2006
Posts: 3013
Location: Hawick, Scotland

PostPosted: Sun Feb 06, 2011 11:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Great work by all concerned.

I have another case which I will be forwarding later this week.
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kinnethmont



Joined: 19 Dec 2006
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Location: Aberdeenshire

PostPosted: Sat Apr 30, 2011 9:10 am    Post subject: IFCP Update Reply with quote

Update

At today's date IFCP has had 1040 casualties accepted by the relevant Military Authority and thus added to the CWGC Roll.
Omissions do not only relate to lowly private soildiers, but decorated personnel also.

Added yesterday was another first for us, the acceptance of a holder of the Victoria Cross who died while serving in 1941

London Gazette on 26 December 1918
War Office, 26th December, 1918

Maj. Blair Anderson Wark, D.S.O., 32nd Bn., A.I.F.
For most conspicuous bravery, initiative and control during the period 29th Sept. to 1st Oct. 1918, in the operations against the Hindenburg Line at Bellicourt and the advance through Nauroy, Etricourt, Magny La Fosse and Joncourt.

On 29th Sept., after personal reconnaissance under heavy fire, he led his command forward at a critical period and restored the situation. Moving fearlessly at the head of, and at times far in advance of, his troops, he cheered his men on through Nauroy, thence towards Etricourt. Still leading his assaulting companies, he observed a battery of 77mm. guns firing on his rear companies and causing heavy casualties. Collecting a few of his men, he rushed the battery, capturing four guns and ten of the crew. Then moving rapidly forward with only two N.C.O.s, he surprised and captured fifty Germans near Magny La Fosse.

On 1st Oct., 1918, he again showed fearless leading and gallantry in attack, and without hesitation and regardless of personal risk dashed forward and silenced machine guns which were causing heavy casualties.
Throughout he displayed the greatest courage, skilful leading and devotion to duty, and his work was invaluable.

See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blair_Wark

Name: WARK, BLAIR ANDERSON
Initials: B A
Nationality: Australian
Rank: Lieutenant Colonel
Regiment/Service: Australian Infantry
Unit Text: Cdg. 1st Bn.
Age: 47
Date of Death: 13/06/1941
Awards: V C, D S O
Casualty Type: Commonwealth War Dead
Grave/Memorial Reference: Columbarium Wall Unit D. Niche 30.
Cemetery: EASTERN SUBURBS CREMATORIUM, BOTANY


MISSING NO MORE
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Jim

If ye break faith with us who die
We shall not sleep, though poppies grow
In Flanders fields.

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kinnethmont



Joined: 19 Dec 2006
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Location: Aberdeenshire

PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2012 9:04 pm    Post subject: IFCP Update Reply with quote

Some here might be interested to learn that IPCP submitted CWGC non comm case 2000 today.

A further 1750 South Africans were submitted in a bulk case.


MISSING NO MORE

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Jim

If ye break faith with us who die
We shall not sleep, though poppies grow
In Flanders fields.

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Adam Brown
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Joined: 14 Dec 2006
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Location: Edinburgh (From Sutherland)

PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2012 9:57 pm    Post subject: Re: IFCP Update Reply with quote

kinnethmont wrote:
A further 1750 South Africans were submitted in a bulk case.


Good grief 1,750. That must be a huge percentage of the total number of South Africa's war dead. Are these black troops which were never recorded during the war?

Kind regards

Adam
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spoons



Joined: 09 Jan 2007
Posts: 4991
Location: St John's Town of Dalry

PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2012 10:10 pm    Post subject: Re: IFCP Update Reply with quote

kinnethmont wrote:
Some here might be interested to learn that IPCP submitted CWGC non comm case 2000 today.

A further 1750 South Africans were submitted in a bulk case.


MISSING NO MORE


Great achievement, well done to all. I am sure each one of these reflects a great deal of research and effort by a number of people.

\Paul
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kinnethmont



Joined: 19 Dec 2006
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Location: Aberdeenshire

PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2012 10:15 pm    Post subject: IFCP Update Reply with quote

Quote:

Good grief 1,750. That must be a huge percentage of the total number of South Africa's war dead.


Not so. The SA total is 21,379
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Jim

If ye break faith with us who die
We shall not sleep, though poppies grow
In Flanders fields.

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David McNay
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 12, 2012 1:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

For a nation to have about 8% of its war dead not commemorated I would say was pretty sizeable, wouldn't you?
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kinnethmont



Joined: 19 Dec 2006
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 12, 2012 7:47 am    Post subject: IFCP Update Reply with quote

Quote:
For a nation to have about 8% of its war dead not commemorated I would say was pretty sizeable, wouldn't you?


Sizeable, but it is not a huge percentage, which was what was written.


Quote:
Are these black troops which were never recorded during the war?


Exactly, they were native troops who were not forwarded.
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Jim

If ye break faith with us who die
We shall not sleep, though poppies grow
In Flanders fields.

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Adam Brown
Curator


Joined: 14 Dec 2006
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Location: Edinburgh (From Sutherland)

PostPosted: Thu Jan 12, 2012 1:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jim

Huge or sizeable. It's really quite a minor point to quibble over. Whatever anyone considers a suitable word for the 8% of missing names it is still a large amount of names for the CWGC to have missed. If the same figure was applied to Scotland's war dead it would mean about 10,000 would have been missed.

What I do have a problem is with you highlighting of the word 'native' instead of the word 'black' which I purposely used. I don't really understand the point of it and would question your reasons for doing it, especially when you are downplaying the significance of the large number of South African deaths not recorded by the IWGC.

Regards

Adam
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kinnethmont



Joined: 19 Dec 2006
Posts: 1649
Location: Aberdeenshire

PostPosted: Thu Jan 12, 2012 8:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Adam

" Native troops " was / is a fairly common term used elsewhere to describe them and I used it ( with highlight ) believing it was more acceptable than the word you used. Whether that is the case as far as this Forum is concerned, I am unsure, but can assure you there was no sinister meaning and am surprised at the suggestion.

I am not downplaying the number who are not currently commemorated in any way.

CWGC have not missed any of the 1750 names out. That responsibility rests with the SA military authorities who, I understand, had the details but did not forward them.
CWGC acted upon the information they recieived at the time.

If you want to delete the whole thread including my update from Wednesday, that will be fine.
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Jim

If ye break faith with us who die
We shall not sleep, though poppies grow
In Flanders fields.

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kinnethmont



Joined: 19 Dec 2006
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Location: Aberdeenshire

PostPosted: Sun Sep 01, 2013 8:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Some may be interested to know it is now possible, via IFCP, for CWGC to add the forenames to casualty records where only initials exist at the present. Such additions have to be backed up by specific official documents.

If those who contact me directly on non comm queries continue to do that I can advise on specific cases and the evidence required in each case. Others can obtain an e-mail address via the website link below.
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Jim

If ye break faith with us who die
We shall not sleep, though poppies grow
In Flanders fields.

www.kinnethmont.co.uk
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