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spoons
Joined: 09 Jan 2007
Posts: 2646
Location: St John's Town of Dalry
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 Posted: Thu Jan 15, 2009 6:58 pm Post subject: |
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| Jen_Hill wrote: | Hi Guys,
I was wondering if any of you can help me...
My Great, Great Grandad features on the memorial, FRED HILL.
I was wondering if anyone can help me find out more information about him. I have no information at all and its so frustrating.
Contact me anytime if anyone can find any information.
Thanks in advance! |
Hi, welcome to the forum, this should really be in the requests section so the mods may move it. With only Fred Hill as a name, commemorated at Duns and with no other info (rank, date of death, regiment etc) it will be almost impossible to identify him with any certainty. There were 220 F Hills who died in WW1 and a good many of them were Fred or Frederick.
No F Hill have Duns recorded on CWGC or SNWM as place of birth or next of kin so if you have nothing in your family records then a search through local newspapers seems the next step.
\Paul |
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Jen_Hill
Joined: 15 Jan 2009
Posts: 4
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| Posted: Thu Jan 15, 2009 7:00 pm Post subject: |
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Thank you for your reply.
I know it crazy... What I don't understand is how he has a mention on a memorial but there is no other information about him anywhere. |
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spoons
Joined: 09 Jan 2007
Posts: 2646
Location: St John's Town of Dalry
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| Posted: Thu Jan 15, 2009 7:14 pm Post subject: |
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| Jen_Hill wrote: | Thank you for your reply.
I know it crazy... What I don't understand is how he has a mention on a memorial but there is no other information about him anywhere. |
Oh, it will be there all right, if he had a highly unusual name we would have identified him by now but with only a fairly common name, he is just one of 220 names on CWGC. When we have enough info to identify him, we will typically have a newspaper obituary, entry on CWGC and a medal index card - possibly also an . The last two are online but someone needs to get into the local library in or near Duns to find the newspaper obituary which would give a date of death and probably a regiment.
By the way, there is no Fred Hill recorded on the 1901 census with a place of birth or residence of Duns but I guess he could have lived in a village or hamlet nearby with a different name.
\Paul |
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Jen_Hill
Joined: 15 Jan 2009
Posts: 4
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| Posted: Thu Jan 15, 2009 7:17 pm Post subject: |
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| I checked the 1901 cenus and I also found that he wasnt on there. I know he was supposedly only 19 and apparently he died on the first day of the war and he died at Somme... I dont know how much truth is in that though. |
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spoons
Joined: 09 Jan 2007
Posts: 2646
Location: St John's Town of Dalry
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| Posted: Thu Jan 15, 2009 7:59 pm Post subject: |
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| Jen_Hill wrote: | | I checked the 1901 cenus and I also found that he wasnt on there. I know he was supposedly only 19 and apparently he died on the first day of the war and he died at Somme... I dont know how much truth is in that though. |
WW1 started on 28 June 1914 and the first Fred Hill to be killed was not until 19th October.
\Paul |
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David McNay
The Boss
Joined: 14 Dec 2006
Posts: 2096
Location: Lanarkshire, Scotland
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| Posted: Thu Jan 15, 2009 8:38 pm Post subject: |
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| spoons wrote: |
this should really be in the requests section so the mods may move it. |
This relates to a name on the memorial so I'm happy for it to remain in this thread for the time being. |
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Jen_Hill
Joined: 15 Jan 2009
Posts: 4
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| Posted: Thu Jan 15, 2009 10:38 pm Post subject: |
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I'm so confused Paul. I might come to Duns on the 28th of this month and see if I can get to the bottom of this.
I wish there was more of my family around to tell me about my family history. |
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Adam Brown
The Boss
Joined: 14 Dec 2006
Posts: 3764
Location: Edinburgh (From Sutherland)
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| Posted: Thu Jan 15, 2009 11:01 pm Post subject: |
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The SNWM only lists three Frederick Hills
HILL Fred 7390 13/04/1915 SCOTS GUARDS Gdsn
HILL Frederick C 03/08/1916 CANADIAN EXPEDITIONARY FORCE Pte
HILL Frederick 4030 15/06/1916 THE ARGYLL AND SUTHERLAND HIGHLANDERS Cpl
Unfortunately the Canadian attestation papers for their Fred Hllls have not been digitised. CWGC mentions he's 42nd Bn which means he is listed on the SNWM roll because he served in a Canadian Scottish unit. CWGC also says he was born in Bristol so we can rule him out I think.
The other two don't give much help either:
This chap died as a PoW and was born in Yorkhire
HILL, Fred
Rank: Private
Regiment/Service: Scots Guards
Unit Text: 1st Bn.
Date of Death: 13/04/1915
Service No: 7390
Place of birth: Hebden Bridge Yorkshire
Grave/Memorial Reference: VII. A. 4.
Cemetery: BERLIN SOUTH-WESTERN CEMETERY
And this one is from Leicestershire
HILL, FREDRICK
Rank: Corporal
Regiment/Service: Argyll and Sutherland Highlanders
Unit Text: 1st/7th Bn.
Age: 27
Date of Death: 15/06/1916
Service No: 4030
Additional information: Son of Lucy Wain (formerly Hill), of George St., Anstey, Leicester, and the late M. Fredrick Hill. Native of Woodhouse Eaves, Loughborough.
Casualty Type: Commonwealth War Dead
Grave/Memorial Reference: II. D. 1.
Cemetery: LOUEZ MILITARY CEMETERY, DUISANS
It looks like they are both listed because they served in Scottish regiments rather than them being Scottish
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Adam Brown
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Joined: 14 Dec 2006
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Location: Edinburgh (From Sutherland)
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| Posted: Thu Jan 15, 2009 11:08 pm Post subject: |
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I thought I'd got him through Geoff's search engine. A Fred Hill died on the Somme from Duns. Unfortunately it's Dunsford he's from!
HILL, FRED
Rank: Corporal
Regiment/Service: Devonshire Regiment
Unit Text: 8th Bn.
Age: 24
Date of Death: 20/07/1916
Service No: 10862
Awards: M M
Additional information: Son of the late Mrs. J. Baker, of Winscombe Cottage, Dunsford, Exeter.
Casualty Type: Commonwealth War Dead
Grave/Memorial Reference: IX. C. 32.
Cemetery: CATERPILLAR VALLEY CEMETERY, LONGUEVAL
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Adam Brown
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Joined: 14 Dec 2006
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Location: Edinburgh (From Sutherland)
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| Posted: Thu Jan 15, 2009 11:23 pm Post subject: |
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Jen
It may help find him if you can provide his parents names and what connection he had to Duns if you know?
Regards
Adam
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kinnethmont
Joined: 19 Dec 2006
Posts: 564
Location: Aberdeenshire
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| Posted: Fri Jan 16, 2009 7:36 pm Post subject: Pte Frederick C Hill, C.E.F. |
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| Quote: | | CWGC mentions he's 42nd Bn which means he is listed on the SNWM roll because he served in a Canadian Scottish unit. CWGC also says he was born in Bristol so we can rule him out I think. |
Adam
SNWN cannot be relied on as accurate.
It is unlikely this Pte Hill is listed by SNWM simply because he was in a Canadian battalion with Scottish links, in this case The Royal Highlanders of Canada. If so, it would follow that all members of the 42nd C.E.F. would be listed by SNWM, and this is not the case. There are, in fact, a very considerable number of C.E.F. men who should be listed, but are absent. I am aware of 500, all born in Scotland.
Although it seems he was born in Bristol it is not impossible that his parents (or at least one of them ) was Scots by birth.
Records show that 418177 Hill was aged 23 and KIA so his age does not tie with Jen's info that he was 19.
As you pointed out, Jen needs to do a bit of research into her family to try to find her relative. If it does come back to 418177 Hill I can get it checked further in Ottawa.
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If ye break faith with us who die
We shall not sleep, though poppies grow
In Flanders fields.
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Adam Brown
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Joined: 14 Dec 2006
Posts: 3764
Location: Edinburgh (From Sutherland)
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| Posted: Fri Apr 03, 2009 12:26 am Post subject: |
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Does anyone have a clear image of the Second World War names, I can't make any of them out.
Regards
Adam
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