The Scottish Military Research Group - Commemorations Project

[spoons]

UKNIWM Ref: 5971

Located on Chapel Brae overlooking Catrine at OS Map Ref NS 531 260. This very tall obelisk is on top of a hill and so needs its own lightning conductor! Although its dominant position overlooking the village provides an excellent view (apart from the strange poles – see pic 7), it is remote from day to day passage of people and so attracts the ‘wrong sort’. There is evidence of grafitti on the bench and campfires although (thankfully) the memorial is clean. The main trouble is that there is only parking for one or two cars at most and it is a long way up a steep hill so the remembrance service is poorly attended. The local amenities committee are trying to raise funds for a memorial park in a central location to make the annual service more viable.

Note that the Great War panel has two names who served in the Italian Forces, very unusual. Anyone know how we might check them out? They are obviously not on CWGC and are not listed on SNWM either.

One that caught my eye…………..

Name: WINNING, HECTOR
Initials: H
Nationality: United Kingdom
Rank: Sergeant (Flt. Engr.)
Regiment/Service: Royal Air Force Volunteer Reserve
Unit Text: 207 Sqdn.
Date of Death: 21/02/1945
Service No: 1821317
Additional information: Son of Hector and Flora Winning, of Catrine, Ayrshire.
Casualty Type: Commonwealth War Dead
Grave/Memorial Reference: Coll. grave 24. A. 1-6.
Cemetery: REICHSWALD FOREST WAR CEMETERY

And from the lost bombers website:

Type Lancaster
Serial Number PB814
Squadron 207
X1D EM-T
Operation Gravenhorst
Date 1 21st February 1945
Date 2 22nd February 1945

PB814 was one of two No.207 Sqdn Lancasters lost on this operation. See: PB295. Airborne 1653 21Feb45 from Spilsby to attack the Mittelland Kanal at Gravenhorst. Those killed are buried in the Reichswald Forest War Cemetery. F/O Phelan had married Brenda Mary Phelan of Chick, Denbighshire. F/O T.B.Phelan RCAF KIA Sgt H.Winning KIA P/O E.Grundy KIA F/S A.A.Oak KIA Sgt F.C.J.O'Shea KIA F/S J.B.Davey RCAF KIA Sgt J.A.Holmes PoW Sgt J.A.Holmes was interned in Camp L1, no PoW No. UK 12May45.

[Adam Brown]

Spoons

I've seen a few Italian names on Great War panels before. There are a few in Edinburgh and two on Cleland's memorial.

I've got the contact details somewhere for Italy's equivalent of the CWGC. I'll see if I can find it.

Regards

Adam

[jamiemcginlay]

I came across the family gravestone of this man in Cathcart Cemetery, Renfrewshire. He is not listed on the Catrine war memorial but there is a birth certificate for a William GIbb born at around the same time in nearby Sorn. Unfortuately Sorn hasn't been posted yet so I don't know if he's listed on the Sorn memorial.

CWGC ENTRY:
Name: GIBB, WILLIAM
Initials: W
Nationality: United Kingdom
Rank: Lance Corporal
Regiment/Service: Highland Light Infantry
Unit Text: 9th (Glasgow Hds.) Bn.
Age: 24
Date of Death: 20/10/1917
Service No: 331028
Additional information: Son of Robert Gibb, of 5, Newlands Crescent, Cathcart, Glasgow. Born at Catrine, Ayrshire.
Casualty Type: Commonwealth War Dead
Grave/Memorial Reference: III. A. 26.
Cemetery: RATION FARM (LA PLUS DOUVE) ANNEXE

[KevinStoke]

SURNAME NAME/INITIAL RANK UNIT BTN WAR YEAR DIED NUMBER WAR MEMORIAL NOTES
BELL JOHN PRIVATE ROYAL SCOTS FUSILIERS WW1 CATRINE AND DISTRICT
BELL JOHN BG PRIVATE ROYAL SCOTS FUSILIERS WW1 CATRINE AND DISTRICT
BIGGAR WILLIAM PRIVATE ROYAL SCOTS FUSILIERS WW1 CATRINE AND DISTRICT
CAMPBELL ROBERT PRIVATE ROYAL SCOTS FUSILIERS WW1 CATRINE AND DISTRICT
CROSS ROBERT PRIVATE ROYAL SCOTS FUSILIERS WW1 CATRINE AND DISTRICT
CURRAN JAMES PRIVATE ROYAL SCOTS FUSILIERS WW1 CATRINE AND DISTRICT
EWING JAMES W SERJEANT ROYAL SCOTS FUSILIERS WW1 CATRINE AND DISTRICT
FOWLER DAVID PRIVATE ROYAL SCOTS FUSILIERS WW1 CATRINE AND DISTRICT
FOWLER ROBERT PRIVATE ROYAL SCOTS FUSILIERS WW1 CATRINE AND DISTRICT
FRAM JAMES PRIVATE ROYAL SCOTS FUSILIERS WW1 CATRINE AND DISTRICT
GORDON CHARLES E LIEUTENANT ROYAL SCOTS FUSILIERS WW1 CATRINE AND DISTRICT
GOURLAY JAMES PRIVATE ROYAL SCOTS FUSILIERS WW1 CATRINE AND DISTRICT MM
HENDERSON JAMES PRIVATE ROYAL SCOTS FUSILIERS WW1 CATRINE AND DISTRICT
HOLYWOOD PATRICK PRIVATE ROYAL SCOTS FUSILIERS WW1 CATRINE AND DISTRICT
KYLE THOMSON PRIVATE ROYAL SCOTS FUSILIERS WW1 CATRINE AND DISTRICT
MEIKLE ROBERT SERJEANT ROYAL SCOTS FUSILIERS WW1 CATRINE AND DISTRICT
MOFFATT JOHN LANCE CORPORAL ROYAL SCOTS FUSILIERS WW1 CATRINE AND DISTRICT
MCADAM JAMES PRIVATE ROYAL SCOTS FUSILIERS WW1 CATRINE AND DISTRICT
MCCHESNIE ALEXANDER SERJEANT ROYAL SCOTS FUSILIERS WW1 CATRINE AND DISTRICT
MCDOUGALL WILLIAM PRIVATE ROYAL SCOTS FUSILIERS WW1 CATRINE AND DISTRICT
MCDOUGALL BERNARD PRIVATE ROYAL SCOTS FUSILIERS WW1 CATRINE AND DISTRICT
MCNAUGHT WILLIAM PRIVATE ROYAL SCOTS FUSILIERS WW1 CATRINE AND DISTRICT
PATERSON THOMAS PRIVATE ROYAL SCOTS FUSILIERS WW1 CATRINE AND DISTRICT
RITCHIE HUGH PRIVATE ROYAL SCOTS FUSILIERS WW1 CATRINE AND DISTRICT
ROBERTSON DANIEL PRIVATE ROYAL SCOTS FUSILIERS WW1 CATRINE AND DISTRICT
ROLLIE WILLIAM PRIVATE ROYAL SCOTS FUSILIERS WW1 CATRINE AND DISTRICT
STEWART ROBERT C SERJEANT ROYAL SCOTS FUSILIERS WW1 CATRINE AND DISTRICT
GEMMELL JOHN SUB LIEUTENANT ROYAL NAVY RESERVE WW1 CATRINE AND DISTRICT
GIBB JOHN CARPENTER ROYAL NAVY RESERVE WW1 CATRINE AND DISTRICT
CONNELLY JOHN PRIVATE BLACK WATCH WW1 CATRINE AND DISTRICT
FOLLEY RICHARD PRIVATE COLDSTREAM GUARDS WW1 CATRINE AND DISTRICT
FOLLEY ROBERT PRIVATE EAST KENT REGIMENT WW1 CATRINE AND DISTRICT
MCLEAN MURDOCH PRIVATE LONSDALE BATTALION WW1 CATRINE AND DISTRICT
TEMPLETON HUGH M LANCE CORPORAL NORTHUMBERLAND FUSILIERS WW1 CATRINE AND DISTRICT
SIMPSON ARCHIBALD SERJEANT ROYAL ENGINEERS WW1 CATRINE AND DISTRICT
HINDS JAMES GUNNER ROYAL FIELD ARTILLERY WW1 CATRINE AND DISTRICT
MCKINNELL JOHN W GUNNER ROYAL GARRISON ARTILLERY WW1 CATRINE AND DISTRICT
WINNING WALTER PRIVATE ROYAL SCOTS WW1 CATRINE AND DISTRICT
GRAY JAMES PRIVATE SCOTS GUARDS WW1 CATRINE AND DISTRICT
REID DAVID PRIVATE SEAFORTH HIGHLANDERS WW1 CATRINE AND DISTRICT
PETRUCCI FERRUCCIO PRIVATE ITALIAN FORCES WW1 CATRINE AND DISTRICT
SISI ANGIOLINO PRIVATE ITALIAN FORCES WW1 CATRINE AND DISTRICT
AITKEN WILLIAM PRIVATE COLONIAL FORCES WW1 CATRINE AND DISTRICT
BARCLAY DAVID M TROOPER COLONIAL FORCES WW1 CATRINE AND DISTRICT
MCCALL JAMES CORPORAL COLONIAL FORCES WW1 CATRINE AND DISTRICT MM
WILSON JOHN PRIVATE COLONIAL FORCES WW1 CATRINE AND DISTRICT
YOUNG ROBERT N PRIVATE COLONIAL FORCES WW1 CATRINE AND DISTRICT
BARRIE WILLIAM J PRIVATE HIGHLAND LIGHT INFANTRY WW1 CATRINE AND DISTRICT
CHALMERS JAMES WB LANCE CORPORAL HIGHLAND LIGHT INFANTRY WW1 CATRINE AND DISTRICT
HAIR THOMAS LANCE CORPORAL HIGHLAND LIGHT INFANTRY WW1 CATRINE AND DISTRICT
HENDERSON GEORGE LANCE CORPORAL HIGHLAND LIGHT INFANTRY WW1 CATRINE AND DISTRICT
MCKINNELL MATTHEW SERJEANT HIGHLAND LIGHT INFANTRY WW1 CATRINE AND DISTRICT
MCDOUGALL ARCHIBALD PRIVATE GORDON HIGHLANDERS WW1 CATRINE AND DISTRICT
MCKINNELL DANIEL CORPORAL GORDON HIGHLANDERS WW1 CATRINE AND DISTRICT
STEELE WILLIAM CORPORAL GORDON HIGHLANDERS WW1 CATRINE AND DISTRICT
TEMPLETON ROBERT PRIVATE GORDON HIGHLANDERS WW1 CATRINE AND DISTRICT
BLACKLEY WALTER PRIVATE CAMERON HIGHLANDERS WW1 CATRINE AND DISTRICT
CLARK JOSEPH PRIVATE CAMERON HIGHLANDERS WW1 CATRINE AND DISTRICT
MCDONALD ROBERT SERJEANT CAMERON HIGHLANDERS WW1 CATRINE AND DISTRICT
FOWLER ROBERT PRIVATE CAMERONIANS WW1 CATRINE AND DISTRICT
MCLELLAND JOHN PRIVATE CAMERONIANS WW1 CATRINE AND DISTRICT
TEMPLETON DAVID A LANCE CORPORAL ARGYLL & SUTHERLAND HIGHLANDERS WW1 CATRINE AND DISTRICT
BLANE WILLIAM TROOPER AYRSHIRE YEOMANRY WW1 CATRINE AND DISTRICT
ANDERSON WILLIAM SERJEANT CAMERON HIGHLANDERS WW2 CATRINE AND DISTRICT
BOAN THOMAS LAC ROYAL AIR FORCE WW2 CATRINE AND DISTRICT
BROWN HL SAPPER ROYAL ENGINEERS WW2 CATRINE AND DISTRICT
CAIRNS WILLIAM CORPORAL DURHAM LIGHT INFANTRY WW2 CATRINE AND DISTRICT
GUTHRIE J FUSILIER ROYAL SCOTS FUSILIERS WW2 CATRINE AND DISTRICT
KIRKWOOD A CORPORAL ROYAL SCOTS FUSILIERS WW2 CATRINE AND DISTRICT
LYLE GEORGE PRIVATE DURHAM LIGHT INFANTRY WW2 CATRINE AND DISTRICT
MITCHELL THOMAS A/B ROYAL NAVY WW2 CATRINE AND DISTRICT
MCDOUGALL J CORPORAL ROYAL SCOTS FUSILIERS WW2 CATRINE AND DISTRICT
MAIN RICHARD PRIVATE EAST LANCASHIRE REGIMENT WW2 CATRINE AND DISTRICT
NELSON J CORPORAL ROYAL SCOTS FUSILIERS WW2 CATRINE AND DISTRICT
PATERSON A PRIVATE BLACK WATCH WW2 CATRINE AND DISTRICT
PATRICK FRANK A/B ROYAL NAVY WW2 CATRINE AND DISTRICT
PETTIGREW WILLIAM PRIVATE ROYAL ARMY MEDICAL CORPS WW2 CATRINE AND DISTRICT
REID WILLIAM PRIVATE ROYAL ARMY DEFENCE CORPS WW2 CATRINE AND DISTRICT
RILLEY T FUSILIER ROYAL SCOTS FUSILIERS WW2 CATRINE AND DISTRICT
SIMPSON ROBERT COMPANY SERJEANT MAJOR ROYAL SCOTS FUSILIERS WW2 CATRINE AND DISTRICT
STEVENS A GUARDSMAN SCOTS GUARDS WW2 CATRINE AND DISTRICT
WATSON J FUSILIER ROYAL SCOTS FUSILIERS WW2 CATRINE AND DISTRICT
WINNING H SERJEANT ROYAL AIR FORCE WW2 CATRINE AND DISTRICT

[Kenneth Morrison]

I'm pretty sure that the Thomas Paterson listed here in the Royal Scots Fusiliers section is:
Thomas Booth Hume Patterson. (note double "T")
Thomas was born in Rochdale, Lancashire in 1890 but the family originated from Gatehouse-of-Fleet in Kirkcudbrightshire and his siblings, older and younger, were born there.
Thomas was a coal miner and married Elizabeth Haining of Wood Street, Catrine in 1913 in Catrine. According to the Stewartry Roll of Honour, and presumably because of his occupation, Thomas did not join the 7th RSF until May 1918. He was wounded at Cambrai and had a lower leg amputated. He died on 26 April 1920 in Kilmarnock Infirmary of illness related to his wound.
Three of his brothers were killed in the War, John William - 15/8/1916, George - 25/9/1915, and Henry - 25/4/1918. They are all listed together on the Anwoth and Girthon Parishes War Memorial in Gatehouse.

Thomas was added to the CWGC Register on 6 August 2020.
_________________
Ken

[DelBoy]

His photo features on the IWM WW1 centenery collection. Flickr link

WW1
HIGHLAND LIGHT INFANTRY
Pte. William J. Barrie

CWGC
BARRIE, WILLIAM
Rank: Private
Service No: 331593
Date of Death: 15/07/1916
Regiment/Service: Highland Light Infantry 9th (Glasgow Highlanders) Bn.
Panel Reference: Pier and Face 15 C.
Memorial: THIEPVAL MEMORIAL

SNWM
Surname: BARRIE
Firstname: William
Service Numbe: 331593
Date Death: 15/07/1916
Place of birth: Girvan
Other: 9th Bn. (T.).
SNWM roll: THE HIGHLAND LIGHT INFANTRY
Rank: Pte
Theatre of death: F.& F.

[govangirl]

Irvine Herald 1 October 1915
" Mrs Jas. Meikle, Wood Street, received a letter from her son, Sgt. Robert Meikle, 5th R.S. F., on Monday under date 15th September, in which he says that his corps are getting things a bit warm at the Dardanelles, having just completed a spell of 25 days in the trenches, and he states that Drummer Willie Biggar was killed last week. Biggar, who belongs to Kilmarnock, resided in Catrine for a time, and is the son-in-law of Mr Alex Fowler, Wood Street. He was well known in football circles, and was an enthusiastic player with Catrine Thistle Club. His death will be regretted by a wide circle of friends. Much sympathy is expressed here on behalf of his parents who had a son killed in France a few months ago. Another brother of Biggar has been missing in the Dardanelles since 12th July."
_________________
Mary

[Kenneth Morrison]

Looks like this might be Willie Biggar?

BIGGAR, W.
Rank:Private
Service No:6028
Date of Death:13/09/1915
Regiment/Service:Royal Scots Fusiliers 4th Bn.
Grave Reference:XI. C. 12.Cemetery:REDOUBT CEMETERY, HELLES
Additional Information:

SNWM has born HAWICK

There are two possibles for his brother:
BIGGAR, JOHN
Rank:Lance Corporal
Service No:7239
Date of Death:12/07/1915
Regiment/Service:Royal Scots Fusiliers 1st/4th Bn.
Panel Reference:Panel 72 to 75.Memorial:HELLES MEMORIAL
Additional Information:

or
BIGGAR, ALEX
Rank:Private
Service No:2742
Date of Death:12/07/1915
Regiment/Service:Highland Light Infantry 6th Bn.
Panel Reference:Panel 173 to 177.Memorial:HELLES MEMORIAL
Additional Information:

Neither has a Place of Birth on SNWM but John Biggar (same Battalion, same Regiment as William) looks the more likely.
_________________
Ken

[Kenneth Morrison]

Sadly Robert Meikle didn't make it off Gallipoli.
MEIKLE, ROBERT.
Rank:Serjeant
Service No:6768
Date of Death:01/01/1916
Age:21
Regiment/Service:Royal Scots Fusiliers 1st/5th Bn.
Panel Reference:Panel 72 to 75. Memorial:HELLES MEMORIAL
Additional Information:Son of James and Janet Meikle, of Wood St., Catrine, Ayrshire.

SNWM
Surname MEIKLE
Forename Robert
Rank A/Sgt
Service number 6768
Decoration
Place of birth Sorn Ayrshire
Date of death 1 January 1916
Theatre of death Gallipoli
Cause of death Died of wounds.
SNWM roll THE ROYAL SCOTS FUSILIERS
_________________
Ken

[govangirl]

[img][/img]
_________________
Mary

[govangirl]

Irvine Herald 10 September 1915
"CATRINE SOLDIERS WOUNDED
Cheerful news has recently been received by Mrs Ewing, Ayrbank Cottage, as to the condition of her son Corporal James W Ewing, 5th R.S.F., whose photo appeared in the “Herald” at the time he was wounded at the Dardanelles. About a month ago he was reported as having died of his wounds, and while this was contradicted from Head-quarters, still no direct word came from him until a few days ago, when his mother received half a dozen letters which had been delayed in transit. He states he had been dangerously ill, but that he is now getting along all right and has been transferred to a Convalescent Ward. He expects to be sent home at an early date to get braced up by the caller Scottish air. Catrine folks both at home and afield welcome the good news and wish Corporal Ewing a speedy recovery."

Sadly James did not survive being killed on 23 April 1917. His service record shows his promotions from Private to L. Corpl on 5 August 1914, Corpl on 25 January 1915, L/Sgt on 24 June 1916 and Sgt on 8 August 1916.

CWGC information

Name: EWING
First Name: James Wilson
Rank: Corporal
Regiment: Royal Scots Fusiliers
Unit: "C" Coy 2nd Bn
Age: 20
Date of death: 23/94/1917
Service no: 41137
Additional information: Son of the late Lt Col Hugh Ewing and Mrs C Ewing
Cemetery/Memorial reference: V. H. 12
Cemetery: WANCOURT BRITISH CEMETERY
_________________
Mary

[govangirl]

Irvine Herald 10 September 1915
"CATRINE SOLDIERS WOUNDED
Corpl. Robert Fowler, of the 5th R.S.F., who was wounded on 12th July at the Dardanelles, arrived home on Thursday. An old member of Catrine Territorial Coy., he rejoined at the outbreak of war. Regarding the fighting on 12th and 13th July he says the Battalion was ordered to take certain trenches and hold them at any cost. We advanced 750 yards when the troops in line with us had to retire and left us exposed on both flanks with the Turks pelting our wings with machine guns. At this point the Naval Brigade came to our assistance. Then we got at them with the bayonet and after some fierce fighting made them turn tail. We had three charges on the 12th, two on the 13th and a counter attack by the Turks, which lasted from midnight to five o’clock in the morning, but we did not flinch, though we had not a single officer left. He was wounded at one o’clock in the morning and was not picked up till seven o’clock at night, having been shot in the shoulder, the arm, and the lower part of his body. Corpl. Fowler is a son of Mrs Hugh Fowler, St. Cuthbert Street. In civilian life he worked in the mines. He is now doing well and expects it will not be long before he is facing the music again."

Sadly Robert was killed on 26 August 1918.
The record of "Soldiers died in the Great War" shows he was born in Sorn and resided in Catrine.

CWGC information

Name: FOWLER
First Name: Robert
Rank: Private
Regiment: Royal Scots Fusiliers
Unit: 1st/5th Bn
Date of Death: 26/08/1918
Service no: 240306
Cemetery/Memorial reference: Panel 6
Cemetery: VIS-EN-ARTOIS MEMORIAL
_________________
Mary

[Adam Brown]

[Kenneth Morrison]

He was a lucky lad to have been found wounded and evacuated. I think "Stewartry" has pointed out before that there isn't a record of any KOSB man (same brigade as Robert) being taken as a Prisoner of War.
_________________
Ken

[govangirl]

Ardrossan & Saltcoats Herald 6 August 1915

_________________
Mary