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KILRENNY, WW1
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jamiemcginlay



Joined: 20 Dec 2006
Posts: 931
Location: Glasgow

PostPosted: Sun Apr 01, 2007 8:22 pm    Post subject: KILRENNY, WW1 Reply with quote

Kilrenny
The memorial does not appear to be listed by UKNIWM

The Kilrenny war memorial takes the form of a freestone mercat cross style monument standing within a railed enclosure.
I'm sure that there are no WWII names listed on the memorial. As a coastal community there are a large number of naval casualties, I take it R.N.R.T. stands for Royal Naval Reserve Trawlers, so many of these men were probably the crew of fishing boats which were requisitioned by the navy to serve, often as minesweepers.







WWI ROLL OF HONOUR:
ANDERSON MITCHELL ROYAL NAVY FIRST ENGINEER R.N.R.T.
ANDERSON WILLIAM BLACK WATCH CORPORAL
BELL DAVID BLACK WATCH PRIVATE
BETT JOHN ROYAL NAVY DECK HAND R.N.R.T.
BISSETT ALEXANDER BLACK WATCH PRIVATE
BLACK ANDREW ROYAL ENGINEERS SAPPER
BLACK GEORGE M. ROYAL DUBLIN FUSILIERS CAPTAIN
BOYTER ALEXANDER BLACK WATCH PRIVATE
BOYTER ALEXANDER BLACK WATCH PRIVATE
BOYTER ALEXANDER BLACK WATCH PRIVATE
BROWN ALEXANDER ROYAL NAVY DECK HAND R.N.R.T.
BROWN GEORGE ROYAL NAVY DECK HAND R.N.R.T.
CAIRNS JAMES ROYAL ARMY SERVICE CORPS LIEUTENANT
CAIRNS W.L. CANADIANS GUNNER CANADIAN ARTILLERY
CHRISTIE JOHN ROYAL NAVY SECOND ENGINEER R.N.R.
CLEMENT D. ALLAN ROYAL ENGINEERS SERGEANT
CORSTORPHINE ALEXANDER ROYAL NAVY DECK HAND R.N.R.T.
CORSTORPHINE GEORGE BLACK WATCH PRIVATE
CUNNINGHAM GEORGE M. BLACK WATCH PRIVATE
DICK ANDREW H. BLACK WATCH PRIVATE
DICK JAMES ROYAL NAVY SEAMAN R.N.R.
DOIG JOHN BLACK WATCH PRIVATE
ELDER CHARLES ROYAL SCOTS CORPORAL
GARDNER ROBERT ROYAL NAVY SEAMAN R.N.R.
GOURLAY JAMES M. ROYAL NAVY DECK HAND R.N.R.T.
HALCROW ANDREW GORDON HIGHLANDERS PRIVATE
HENDERSON ANDREW ROYAL NAVY SKIPPER R.N.R.T.
HERD JOHN CANADIANS PRIVATE CANADIAN INFANTRY
KEAY ALEXANDER G. ROYAL NAVY MATE R.N.R.T.
KEAY P.H. CANADIANS PRIVATE CANADIAN ENGINEERS
LOW WALLACE GORDON HIGHLANDERS PRIVATE
MACKAY ANGUS BLACK WATCH PRIVATE
MONCRIEFF ALEXANDER CANADIANS PRIVATE CANADIAN INFANTRY
MONCRIEFF GEORGE GORDON HIGHLANDERS PRIVATE
MONCRIEFF JAMES A. ROYAL NAVY STOKER R.N.R.
MONCRIEFF JOHN SEAFORTH HIGHLANDERS LANCE CORPORAL
MONCRIEFF WILLIAM ROYAL SCOTS PRIVATE
MURRAY JAMES CANADIANS CORPORAL CANADIAN HIGHLANDERS
PARKER C.M. BLACK WATCH PRIVATE
RAY P. OLIPHANT ROYAL FLYING CORPS SECOND LIEUTENANT
REEKIE WILLIAM ROYAL NAVY SEAMAN R.N.R.
REID DAVID ROYAL NAVY DECK HAND R.N.R.T.
ROBERTSON ANDREW LABOUR CORPS PRIVATE
ROBERTSON DAVID SCOTS GUARDS PRIVATE
SHIRREFF ROBERT BLACK WATCH PRIVATE
SMITH JOHN ROYAL SCOTS ROYAL SCOTS
SMITH ROBERT R. MACHINE GUN CORPS LIEUTENANT
SMITH THOMAS ROYAL SCOTS SECOND LIEUTENANT
TARVIT JAMES BLACK WATCH PRIVATE
TARVIT WILLIAM ROYAL NAVY TRIMMER R.N.R.T.
THOMSON JOHN ARGYLL & SUTHERLAND HIGHLANDERS LANCE CORPORAL
THOMSON JOHN ROYAL NAVY MASTER MARINER R.T.S.
THOMSON ROBERT ROYAL NAVY LEADING SEAMAN R.N.R.
WALLACE ROBERT ROYAL NAVY MATE R.N.R.T.
WATSON ALEXANDER BLACK WATCH PRIVATE
WATSON ALEXANDER ROYAL NAVY SKIPPER R.N.R.T.
WATSON ROBERT BLACK WATCH PRIVATE
WATSON W.B. BLACK WATCH LANCE CORPORAL
WATSON WILLIAM ROYAL NAVY STOKER R.N.R.
WILSON DAVID ROYAL NAVY DECK HAND R.N.R.T.
WILSON GEORGE CANADIANS SERGEANT CANADIAN INFANTRY
WOOD JOHN M. ROYAL NAVY SEAMAN R.N.R.
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dhubthaigh
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Location: Blairgowrie, Perthshire

PostPosted: Sun Apr 01, 2007 9:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Three Alexander Boyters for the Black Watch!

One of them being;
Name: BOYTER, ALEXANDER
Initials: A
Nationality: United Kingdom
Rank: Private
Regiment/Service: Black Watch (Royal Highlanders)
Unit Text: 7th Bn.
Age: 25
Date of Death: 30/05/1916
Service No: 2205
Additional information: Son of Helen and the late Thomas Boyter, of Cellardyke, Fife. Father of deceased blown up by a German mine in North Sea. Casualty Type: Commonwealth War Dead
Grave/Memorial Reference: I. F. 8.
Cemetery: MAROEUIL BRITISH CEMETERY

His father is listed by CWGC but not on the Memorial?

Name: BOYTER, THOMAS
Initials: T
Nationality: United Kingdom
Rank: Second Hand
Regiment/Service: Mercantile Marine
Unit Text: Fishing Boat "Jane" (Berwick)
Age: 55
Date of Death: 14/08/1917
Additional information: Son of the late James and Mary Boyter; husband of Helen Boyter (nee Brown), of Rodger St., Cellardyke, Anstruther, Fifeshire. Born at Cellardyke.
Casualty Type: Commonwealth War Dead
Memorial: TOWER HILL MEMORIAL
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jamiemcginlay



Joined: 20 Dec 2006
Posts: 931
Location: Glasgow

PostPosted: Sun Apr 01, 2007 10:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Forgot to mention that, the three Alexander Boyters are differentiated as being:
Alexander Boyter (Brown)
Alexander Boyter (Smith)
Alexander Boyter (Bowman)
I don't understand what this means, I hoped someone else might throw some light on it.
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dhubthaigh
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 01, 2007 10:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mother's maiden surname.
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Adam Brown
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 01, 2007 11:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jim

You didn't mention the carvings of the servicemen. Do you have any opinions on them?

Adam
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jamiemcginlay



Joined: 20 Dec 2006
Posts: 931
Location: Glasgow

PostPosted: Mon Apr 02, 2007 10:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Good call, I suppose it must be the maiden surname but its very unusual. I've seen men with the same names differentiated by including their regiment or battalion etc., but never maiden surname.

Adam I suppose the most striking feature of the sculpture is its childlike simplicity. There might be two explanations for this. It could be the work of a sculptor who wanted to give a naive or primitive quality to the work, which seems very unlikely; or its the work of the local monumental mason who was responsible for the rest of the monument and perhaps through limited funds was also asked to execute the relief sculptures. Personally I love this kind of work which might be classed as a kind of folk art. I always think you can see the heart that was put into this kind of work (you often find that the same mason might have carved the name of his own son or brother onto the memorial) and personally I prefer memorials like this to the bigger monuments with bronze sculptures...but thats my own opinion and I'm probably being unfair to the more famous sculptors who also lost family and friends in the Great War.
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kevin dunion



Joined: 06 Jul 2007
Posts: 3
Location: Fife

PostPosted: Sat Jul 07, 2007 2:38 pm    Post subject: Kilrenny (Cellardyke) memorial details Reply with quote

Just some additional information . The memorial was designed by a Kirkcaldy architect, Mr Murdoch; it is 23 ft high. The sculpted panels include the Kilrenny burgh coat of arms; a plough to represent the farming community and a steam drifter to represent the fishing community. The drifter has the precise detail of a wireless added , as it would have when requisitioned by the Admiralty. It was unveiled on 12 March 1922. It stands on the Town Green at the eastern edge of Cellardke- it was originally intended for Kilrenny Common but the relatives of the Cellardyke men who overwhelmingly are those listed on it rebelled against that plan.
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dhubthaigh
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 18, 2007 12:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

KILRENNY
UKNIWM Ref: 5760

Physical Description
COLUMN ON THREE SIDED STONE BASE, SURMOUNTED BY A GILT BALL.
AT EACH CORNER OF THE TOP OF THE BASE IS A STONE LION. ON EACH FACE OF TH BASE ARE RELIEFS: A SAILOR, A SOLDIER, AND CROSSED SWORDS WITH A WREATH
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john burnett



Joined: 29 Jan 2007
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 21, 2008 3:17 pm    Post subject: Kilrenny Reply with quote

Thanks to Mrs Aase Goldsmith for the following information.
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john burnett



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PostPosted: Tue Dec 30, 2008 8:01 pm    Post subject: Kilrenny Reply with quote

Thanks to Mrs Aase Goldsmith for the photos. They show some of the details mentioned by other contributors.










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john burnett



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Location: Fife

PostPosted: Tue Jan 20, 2009 3:47 pm    Post subject: Kilrenny Reply with quote

Further to Kevin Dunion's post of 7 Jul 2007.
Got this from following
http://www.scottisharchitects.org.uk/index.php

"Alexander Murdoch was an architectural and monumental sculptor who worked in Abbotshall Road, Kirkcaldy."

Murdoch did the Auchterderran one as well.
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DelBoy



Joined: 12 Jul 2007
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Location: The County of Angus

PostPosted: Fri Aug 12, 2011 1:12 am    Post subject: Tarvit Reply with quote

jamiemcginlay wrote:
TARVIT JAMES BLACK WATCH PRIVATE
TARVIT WILLIAM ROYAL NAVY TRIMMER R.N.R.T.


I think these may be brothers. Although only James is on CWGC or SNWM.

CWGC
Name: TARVIT, JAMES
Initials: J
Nationality: United Kingdom
Rank: Sapper
Regiment/Service: Royal Engineers
Unit Text: Railway Operating Div.
Age: 27
Date of Death: 20/06/1917
Service No: 198505
Additional information: Son of the late Mr. and Mrs. James Tarvit, of Cellardyke, Fife.
Casualty Type: Commonwealth War Dead
Grave/Memorial Reference: N. 470.
Cemetery: SHORNCLIFFE MILITARY CEMETERY

SNWM
Surname: TARVIT
Firstname: James
Service Number: 198505
Date Death: 20/06/1917
Place of birth: Kilrenny, Fife
Other: R.O.D.
SNWM roll: THE ROYAL ENGINEERS
Rank: Spr
Theatre of death: Home.

William Tarvit died of T.B. on 13th October 1918 aged 22 at Cellardyke.
According to the Death Certificate he was "Trimmer in R.N.R. on Gunner 'Pelagos'"

Cheers,
Derek.
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Adam Brown
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 12, 2011 8:58 am    Post subject: Re: Tarvit Reply with quote

DelBoy wrote:
William Tarvit died of T.B. on 13th October 1918 aged 22 at Cellardyke.
According to the Death Certificate he was "Trimmer in R.N.R. on Gunner 'Pelagos'"


Is he a non-comm then?

Adam
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kinnethmont



Joined: 19 Dec 2006
Posts: 1649
Location: Aberdeenshire

PostPosted: Fri Aug 12, 2011 5:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Is he a non-comm then?


No.


If he was still serving in the RNR he would have to be embodied to qualify for war dead status, otherwise he would have to have died due to war related causes.
As a Reserve, he is still a civilian, and will not qualify if his death death due to his usual occupational risks, illness, etc.
He might not have actually been in the RNR when he died. This is often stated in fishing communities but inaccurate.
There is no sign of an RNR record for him.
_________________
Jim

If ye break faith with us who die
We shall not sleep, though poppies grow
In Flanders fields.

www.kinnethmont.co.uk


Last edited by kinnethmont on Mon May 07, 2012 6:06 am; edited 1 time in total
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FortyTwa



Joined: 12 May 2009
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Location: United Kingdom

PostPosted: Sun May 06, 2012 11:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Some pix taken on a recent visit


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