The Scottish Military Research Group - Commemorations Project

DerekR · Posted: Tue Feb 20, 2007 6:07 pm Post subject: Langholm

UKNIWM Ref No. 2109
OS map ref: NY360844
Location: behind Langholm Parish Church in the park opposite Elizabeth Street.

I had forgotten just how good this memorial is. I couldn't see any sculptors marks on the statue which is a pity as I'd be very interested to know who was behind it.
It lists 131 Great War casualties and 23 Second World War casualties.

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Time but th' impression stronger makes, As streams their channels deeper wear.

DerekR · Posted: Tue Feb 20, 2007 6:09 pm Post subject:

Second World War

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Time but th' impression stronger makes, As streams their channels deeper wear.

DerekR · Posted: Tue Feb 20, 2007 6:12 pm Post subject:

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Time but th' impression stronger makes, As streams their channels deeper wear.

spoons · Posted: Tue Feb 20, 2007 11:21 pm Post subject:

Lovely memorial. I am due a trip up that way but not for a couple of weeks yet - gives me something to look forward to.

DerekR · Posted: Wed Feb 21, 2007 9:59 am Post subject:

Details of the 131 Great War names:

Dick Bell KOSB
W Black Royal Scots
Tom Blacklock Lovat Scouts
A.H. Blaylock Argyll & Sutherland Highlanders
T Borthwick K.O.R.Lancashire Fusiliers
Tom Borthwick Machine Gun Corps
J.L Borthwick Gordon Highlanders
W.B. Brooks Cameron Highlanders
H Burnet KOSB
F Burnet HLI
William Davidson Cairns Black Watch
E Calvert Gordon Highlanders
John Clark KOSB
John Comrie Black Watch
Charles C. Cooper Royal Scots
John Corrie Tank Corps
William Dalgleish KOSB
J.B. Dalgleish KOSB
J Davidson Northumberland Fusiliers
R Davidson Gordon Highlanders
Charles Dunbar KOSB
G Duncan Royal Scots
W.L. Easton Royal Army Service Corps
William Elliot KOSB
W Elliot Royal Garrison Artillery
J.B. Ewart Gordon Highlanders
James Bell Ewart KOSB
M Fairley Border Regiment
Archibald Glendinning Fairley Canadians
Jackson Irving Fletcher KOSB
Andrew D. Fletcher KOSB
William Fletcher KOSB
James Foster Gordon Highlanders
T Geddes-Ritchie Rifle Brigade
Jos Graham Blue Cross
J Graham Gordon Highlanders
W.J. Graham Lothian & Border Horse
H Grant KOSB
J Grieve Gordon Highlanders
J.H. Halliday HLI
William Harkness KOSB
J Heard Seaforth Highlanders
D Herries Gordon Highlanders
W.B. Hiddlestone Liverpool Scottish
Robert Hotson KOSB
John Hounam Royal Engineers
P Irving Royal Scots Fusiliers
J.J. Irving Canadians
T Jackson Gordon Highlanders
J Jackson Gordon Highlanders
James Jardine KOSB
Jos Jardine Royal Scots
R.A. Knight Cameron Highlanders
Charles Paterson Laidlaw KOSB
G Lawson Royal Scots
J.W. Lightbody Northumberland Fusiliers
F Little Royal Scots
Thomas Little KOSB
L Mail Canadians
J Main Royal Scots
John Malcolm KOSB
H.W. Mann Cameron Highlanders
Thomas Martin KOSB
T Martin Scottish Rifles
P Martin Royal Navy
Matthew Maxwell KOSB
William Maxwell KOSB
R.J. McCleary Royal Field Artillery
D. McCleary Royal Irish Fusiliers
George McCracken KOSB
S McGowan M.C. KOSB
J. McKnight Royal West Surrey Regiment
Thomas McVittie KOSB
J McVittie Canadians
W.J. Mellis Machine Gun Corps
J Millar Cameron Highlanders
W Millar Northumberland Hussars
J.G. Millar Cameron Highlanders
R Milligan HLI
R Moffat Border Regiment
James Byers Morrison KOSB
Jas Park Lincoln Regiment
Jos.E. Park Royal Garrison Artillery
T Porteous Australians
J Rae KOSB
William Ramage KOSB
G Reid HLI
James Reid KOSB
J Richardson KOSB
Robert Robinson KOSB
H.S.S. Robinson KOSB
C Roddick Scottish Rifles
W.C. Sanders Canadians
J Scott Royal Field Artillery
Samuel Scott Argyll & Sutherland Highlanders
John Scott London Scottish
Isaac Scott KOSB
William Scott Royal Munster Fusiliers
J Scott KOSB
Alex Scott Royal Defence Corps
Frank J.N. Shepard KOSB
A Telfer Argyll & Sutherland Highlanders
Robert Thompson KOSB
J Thompson Black Watch
J Thompson Royal Army Service Corps
David Thomson KOSB
R.D. Thomson Argyll & Sutherland Highlanders
James Thomson Black Watch
F Thomson Border Regiment
John Thomson Manchester Regiment
Jos Turnbull Scottish Rifles
Adam Waldie KOSB
D Wallace Border Regiment
W Wallace Cameron Highlanders
J Warwick KOSB
John Warwick KOSB
A Watt Scots Greys
J.J. Wright Royal Scots
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Time but th' impression stronger makes, As streams their channels deeper wear.

spoons · Posted: Sun Mar 11, 2007 4:44 pm Post subject:

There is a further inscription panel at the back with just a list of theatres of war. I will post all the inscriptions again so that the WW2 panels appear with the corresponding WW1.

spoons · Posted: Sun Mar 11, 2007 4:53 pm Post subject:

I know that winged victory is a standard theme for memorials, but has anyone noticed the great similarity between Langholm and Lockerbie?

Langholm on the left and Lockerbie on the right.

DerekR · Posted: Sun Mar 11, 2007 7:51 pm Post subject:

I've photographed both memorials and they didn't strike me as similar until you mentioned it Shocked

I searched both memorials for sculptor marks but found none but I see your view of the Lockerbie monument shows a mark below the foot of the "angel".
Did you manage to make the name out?
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Time but th' impression stronger makes, As streams their channels deeper wear.

spoons · Posted: Sun Mar 11, 2007 8:16 pm Post subject:

sorry, I didn't see a name on either statue, the mark in close up is bird c***. UKNIWM credits the Lockerbie memorial to H.C. Fehr but there is no mention of a scultor for Langholm. There are obvious differences in the heads, below the feet etc but the folds in the clothes and the feathers are so similar, they have to have come from the same mould or a direct copy. I think my preference is for Langholm.

Adam Brown · Posted: Sun Mar 11, 2007 9:44 pm Post subject:

I notice that the torso and head are different. The Lockerbie Victory has a belt and everything above that is different but the arms and wings are the same.

Derek

After seeing your comment about the names on the church memorial I looked at the names here and see two J.B. Ewarts. One Gordons and one KOSB.

Adam

DerekR · Posted: Fri Jun 15, 2007 8:39 pm Post subject:

The site for the Langholm War Memorial caused a difference of opinion after the Great War.
A public plebiscite was held in 1919 to vote on one of 6 offered sites.

In the end, 313 votes were cast for Buccleuch Park, whilst 251 were made for the cemetery site.
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Time but th' impression stronger makes, As streams their channels deeper wear.

DerekR · Posted: Sat Jun 16, 2007 8:18 pm Post subject:

Surname CAIRNS
Firstname William Davidson
Service Number S/8496
Date Death 21/01/1916
Decoration
Place of birth Langholm Dumfriesshire
Other 2nd Bn.
SNWM roll THE BLACK WATCH (ROYAL HIGHLANDERS)
Rank Pte
Theatre of death Persian Gulf.
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Time but th' impression stronger makes, As streams their channels deeper wear.

jamiemcginlay · Joined: 20 Dec 2006 Posts: 930 Location: Glasgow

According to my information the sculptor was indeed H.C. Fehr.

Fehr executed very similar figures for Lockerbie (unveiled 07/05/1922) and also the war memorial at Eastbourn (unveiled 10/11/1920) which can be seen here:
http://images.google.co.uk/imgres?imgurl=http://www.eastbourne-web.co.uk/history/a_short_history_of_eastbourne/images/war_memorial.JPG&imgrefurl=http://www.eastbourne-web.co.uk/history/a_short_history_of_eastbourne/11_the_great_war_and_after.asp&h=296&w=150&sz=8&hl=en&start=18&sig2=C8LdEdgAukVvolf16cDb4g&um=1&tbnid=Y_m56qF6LO1WhM:&tbnh=116&tbnw=59&eid=&eid=hlVZR7fcHpXK0gSGse3eCQ&prev=/images%3Fq%3Deastbourne%2Bwar%2Bmemorial%26svnum%3D10%26um%3D1%26hl%3Den%26sa%3DN%26ie%3DUTF-8%26oe%3DISO-8859-1

and Colchester which can be seen here:
http://images.google.co.uk/imgres?imgurl=http://www.camulos.com/virtual/Memorial.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.camulos.com/virtual/guidea.htm&h=640&w=480&sz=49&hl=en&start=3&sig2=Q8noBGzZT6N3peI98Gan5A&um=1&tbnid=YbfEPhTeaMvYnM:&tbnh=137&tbnw=103&eid=&eid=AFhZR6y_OJK80QSIsJ3WCQ&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dcolchester%2Bwar%2Bmemorial%26svnum%3D10%26um%3D1%26hl%3Den%26sa%3DG%26ie%3DUTF-8%26oe%3DISO-8859-1

He also executed war memorials for Leeds (unveiled 14/10/1922) which can be seen here with a brief biography on the sculptor:
http://images.google.co.uk/imgres?imgurl=http://myweb.tiscali.co.uk/speel/pics/fehr1.jpg&imgrefurl=http://myweb.tiscali.co.uk/speel/sculpt/fehr.htm&h=480&w=271&sz=30&hl=en&start=22&sig2=w3PK-WoFxbn_KcZiaTIMww&um=1&tbnid=FjEk9k3HzS2zLM:&tbnh=129&tbnw=73&eid=&eid=uVdZR-XYB5H80gSdwKzgCQ&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dleeds%2Bwar%2Bmemorial%26start%3D18%26ndsp%3D18%26svnum%3D10%26um%3D1%26hl%3Den%26sa%3DN%26ie%3DUTF-8%26oe%3DISO-8859-1

Adam Brown · Posted: Thu Jun 04, 2009 10:11 pm Post subject:

This man is listed in SNWM but not CWGC. On the memorial his unit is given as Blue Cross.

GRAHAM, Joseph
Service Number: SE/4278
Date Death: 30/08/1916
Place of birth: Langholm, Dumfries
SNWM roll: VARIOUS CORPS.
Rank: Pte
Theatre of death: Egypt.

There is a man listed on CWGC with a similar number, a date of death similar to the one above and died in Egypt. Is he the same man? What was the Blue Cross, was it a Veterinary Unit?

GRAHAM, J
Rank: Private
Regiment/Service: Army Veterinary Corps
Unit Text: 16th Vet. Hosp.
Date of Death: 03/08/1916
Service No: SE/4272
Casualty Type: Commonwealth War Dead
Grave/Memorial Reference: F. 143.
Cemetery: CAIRO WAR MEMORIAL CEMETERY

Regards

Adam

spoons · Posted: Thu Jun 04, 2009 10:42 pm Post subject:

The Blue Cross was, and still is, an animal charity that has always had close ties with the Army Veterinary Services and did much work with horses and dogs on the battlefields of WW1. So highly probably the same man.